Pietenpol-List: machined parts online

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Original Posted By: "DJ Vegh"
Last week DJ started a thread concerning machined parts and how to make 'em.Today (slacking off at work) I was surfing the net and found a pretty neatsite. This site is for a fabrication company that has a pretty neat idea (Iam not in anyway associated with the company, I just though you all wouldfind it interesting too). Basically, you design what you need made, orderit online, and they send it to you. They let you download a free CAD/CAMprogram that you draw what you need. The software has all the material thatthey stock and knows their machining capabilities so you can't designsomething they can't make. Once you get it drawn, the software actuallygives you a price (including shipping) based on quantities and deliverytime.I drew up a 0.063 thick fitting using 4140 with some holes in it, and foundit was $120 total for 10. Of couse you could order one or 10000 and itgives you a price with adjusted delivery dates. The neat thing is it tookan hour from download to price quote and I didn't have to speak to a singlesalesperson.I just though this might be an alternate route to getting some fittings cut.The website is:emachineshop.comRobert HainesPietenpol wanna-beDu Quoin, Illinois________________________________________________________________________________

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Original Posted By: "Robert Haines"
I'm going to try this right now.... this could be a revolution forhomebuilders if it really works like it says it does!DJ VeghN74DVwww.raptoronline.comMesa, AZ----- Original Message -----

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Original Posted By: "DJ Vegh"
hello allBased on this site for fabricating metal parts I have been planning to makea site for all parts related to Piets. Not to sell them just list thenames of the people and or companies for piet parts. For example this website. some Model A car companies, covairs, wood, instruments, wheels thelist goes on. If anyone has some ideas I would like to hear them. I seepeople asking where someone got this or that. a site for nothing but pietparts would be nice. I placed such an add in the BPA but no one answeredit. maybe they was thinking I was trying make a buck...NOT.John C.----- Original Message -----

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Original Posted By: "John Carmen"
ok... I just tried my hand at it. the software they provide is very basic,but will work.I have a question though... they only provide 4140 steel. can 4140 be usedin place of 4130 for things like wing attach plates?DJ VeghN74DVwww.raptoronline.comMesa, AZ----- Original Message -----

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Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
For those interested in getting parts made, one of the biggest expenses isfor material. Aircraft Spruce and Dillsburg have 4130 and some aluminum,but for the sizes of aluminum needed for big parts I found the best sourceto be Yarde Metals. They will sell remnants from big companies for afraction of their value for new material. I bought BIG (9-1/4" diameter)rounds of 6061-T651 aluminum for my wheel hubs there for less than 1/3 whatthe material would have cost new. Check out their "Drop Zone" website at:http://www.yarde.com/cgi-bin/dropzone.plJack -----Original Message-----

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Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Hi John,If you had some links to Model-A engine folks, I wouldn't mind seeingthem.Thanks,Ken-----Original Message-----

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Original Posted By: "Robert Haines"
Just finished re-drawing all my parts with the emachines.com drawingutility.after selecting the material and method of cutting (4140, lasercut) I got aprice for all my pieces including shipping. All my wing attach plates willbe about $200. Thats $300 cheaper than all the other laser shops.I think I'm gonna try this place and see what happens.DJ VeghN74DVwww.raptoronline.comMesa, AZ----- Original Message -----

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Original Posted By:>> "DJ Vegh"
Dj, 4140 steel is more of a spring steel and would be inappropriate to use a a 4130 replacement.Chris Bobka "DJ Vegh" wrote:>>>ok... I just tried my hand at it. the software they >provide is very basic,>but will work.>>I have a question though... they only provide 4140 steel. > can 4140 be used>in place of 4130 for things like wing attach plates?>>>DJ Vegh>N74DV>www.raptoronline.com>Mesa, AZ>>>----- Original Message ----->From: "John Carmen" >To: >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: machined parts online>>>>>>> hello all>>>> Based on this site for fabricating metal parts I have >>been planning to>make>> a site for all parts related to Piets. Not to sell >>them just list the>> names of the people and or companies for piet parts. >> For example this>web>> site. some Model A car companies, covairs, wood, >> instruments, wheels>the>> list goes on. If anyone has some ideas I would like to >>hear them. I see>> people asking where someone got this or that. a site >>for nothing but piet>> parts would be nice. I placed such an add in the BPA >> but no one>answered>> it. maybe they was thinking I was trying make a >>buck...NOT.>>>>>> John C.>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----

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Original Posted By: "Ken Goff"
I guess a site for noting but piets would be nice. Ill round up what I havefor you Ken and email themJohn----- Original Message -----

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Original Posted By: Gary Gower

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Original Posted By: clif

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Original Posted By: "DJ Vegh"
DJ, they didn't have 4130 on the list so I chose 4140. True, 4140 is not4130. Yield strength (normalized) for 4140 is 95,000psi where 4130 is63,250psi. 4140 is a stiffer and harder. In compairison, there is adifference between 4130 and 1020. 1020 (or is it 1015 that's used in thedesign?) has a yield strenght (normalized) of 48,000psi and yes, there isless difference between 1020 and 4130 as there is between 4130 and 4140.Although, 4130 and 4140 both are in the same alloy family and possessapproximately the same corrosion resistance. But wait, 1018 is on theirlist and that's about the same as 1020.:)Sorry, just trying to diffuse an anticipated debate on the "appropriate"type of metal to use. My personal opinion (take is as you may) is thatthese metal fitting are going to bolt into a piece of wood. Which will failfirst under the stress and vibration, the wood or the metal? Regardless ofcorrosion resistance, you're going to paint the fittings anyway. I notsuggesting that we use this as a license to use inappropriate materials,just to keep in mind what the material is being asked to do.Robert HainesP.S. - I agree with you, the prices given were really good. I disagree withJack Phillips, respectfully of course, that the big cost of machined partsis the material. Given the quantities that we are talking about here, thebig costs are the initiall fixed costs of design and setup, which wouldtaken longer than fabrication of the order. That's why my part was $95 if Ibought one and $20 more if I bought ten.________________________________________________________________________________

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Original Posted By: Les Schubert
I agree about the cost issue. My parts were about $60 for one but if Ibought 8 it went down to $9.I noticed something though... I have 4 different parts I need cut. If Idrew each part up as a separate drawing/job the price was higher than if Idid one drawing with all the parts together. It was about half as much incost. I wonder if they will accept an order that way?Guess I'll try and see.DJ VeghN74DVwww.raptoronline.comMesa, AZ> P.S. - I agree with you, the prices given were really good. I disagreewith> Jack Phillips, respectfully of course, that the big cost of machined parts> is the material. Given the quantities that we are talking about here, the> big costs are the initiall fixed costs of design and setup, which would> taken longer than fabrication of the order. That's why my part was $95 ifI> bought one and $20 more if I bought ten.>This email has been scanned for known viruses and made safe for viewing by Half Price Hosting, a leading email and web hosting provider. For more information on an anti-virus email solution, visit .________________________________________________________________________________Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 09:26:27 -0600

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Original Posted By:> owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Funny DJ. I was doing the same - putting several on the page. As thesoftware is beta, I am guessing this is a new service and they still haveissues like this to resolve.-Gary> -----Original Message-----

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Original Posted By: "Gary McNeel, Jr."
I thought the same about it being beta and I shouldn't be allowed to do morethan one piece per drawing, but I emailed them and asked..... they said itwas ok to do it that way to save $$.DJ VeghN74DVwww.raptoronline.comMesa, AZ----- Original Message -----

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Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Guys,I hope when you "nest" the parts for cutting that you take into account thatany bend must be across the grain of the steel. Otherwise you will invitea certain crack. If you have two bends and each are 90 degrees to eachother then you can either choose which bend is more critical to structureintegrity or turn the piece so that both bends are 45 degrees to the grain.Nesting for minimum steel waste may not produce the best part. Also, it iscommon to make the parts a few thousands oversize in dimension knowing thatsome hardened material will need to be ground off.I do not believe that sandblasting will remove the hardened material as itis too hard. One of the experts on the list may be able to shed more onthis.chris bobka-----Original Message-----

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Original Posted By: "Christian Bobka"
Sand blasting and the like will stress relive the part. do it before andafter the part is bent. and add a larger radius to the bend that is goingwith the grain. Remember not to use the sand that did steel on aluminum forthe metal particles will get in the aluminum and corrode it.My two cents if anyone cares.John C.----- Original Message -----

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Original Posted By: "Oscar Zuniga"
Hmmmm, will a plane made with CNC laser cut metal parts still be able to becalled a Pietenpol? Inquiring minds want to know.....Bert, where are you?Ted----- Original Message -----

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Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Hmmmm. Since CNC processes would be used, I contend that we would have torefer to at as CN-1.Chris Bobka-----Original Message-----

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Original Posted By: Les Schubert