Original Posted By: Clif Dawson
Pietenpol-List: New shop
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Mike B."
Insulation, heat/cool system, lots of 115V and a few 220V plugs and lots oflight.I don't have any of these but I wish I did.Chris T.Sacramento, Ca----- Original Message -----
Insulation, heat/cool system, lots of 115V and a few 220V plugs and lots oflight.I don't have any of these but I wish I did.Chris T.Sacramento, Ca----- Original Message -----
Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: John Myers
12/10/2003 07:31:52 AMHey Mike: I think you should build it in my back yard, thus avoiding theincrease in realestate taxes. Of course in exchange I will build my projectin there ;-)John"Mike B." (at)matronics.com on 12/10/2003 12:10:30 AMPlease respond to pietenpol-list(at)matronics.comSent by: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.comcc:Subject: Pietenpol-List: New shopI'm building a new 30'x40'x13' shop (slab should be pured next week.) Iwas wondering if there are things that I should consider while buildingthe structure (of my design. Yikes!)I thought this would be a good opportunity to avoid any "I wish I hadinstalled a such-n-such" situations. What kind of airplane-buildingspecific things might I consider before I get started? Most importantly,what kind of things that can't be done once the building is finishedshould I consider?-Mike.________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 06:43:40 -0600
12/10/2003 07:31:52 AMHey Mike: I think you should build it in my back yard, thus avoiding theincrease in realestate taxes. Of course in exchange I will build my projectin there ;-)John"Mike B." (at)matronics.com on 12/10/2003 12:10:30 AMPlease respond to pietenpol-list(at)matronics.comSent by: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.comcc:Subject: Pietenpol-List: New shopI'm building a new 30'x40'x13' shop (slab should be pured next week.) Iwas wondering if there are things that I should consider while buildingthe structure (of my design. Yikes!)I thought this would be a good opportunity to avoid any "I wish I hadinstalled a such-n-such" situations. What kind of airplane-buildingspecific things might I consider before I get started? Most importantly,what kind of things that can't be done once the building is finishedshould I consider?-Mike.________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 06:43:40 -0600
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Mike B."
I would make sure that there is a vapor barrier under the slab for sure.Perimeter insulation for colder climates plus heating coils in the slab. Ofcourse, if you are in a cold climate, insulate heavily. Cheap and easy now.difficult later. Lots of lighting and outlets. Master switches by the door.Cy Galley - Bellanca Champion ClubNewsletter Editor & EAA TCwww.bellanca-championclub.comActively supporting Aeroncas every dayQuarterly newsletters on timeReasonable document reprints----- Original Message -----
I would make sure that there is a vapor barrier under the slab for sure.Perimeter insulation for colder climates plus heating coils in the slab. Ofcourse, if you are in a cold climate, insulate heavily. Cheap and easy now.difficult later. Lots of lighting and outlets. Master switches by the door.Cy Galley - Bellanca Champion ClubNewsletter Editor & EAA TCwww.bellanca-championclub.comActively supporting Aeroncas every dayQuarterly newsletters on timeReasonable document reprints----- Original Message -----
Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Sayre, William G"
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Mike B."
Mike,I built a 20'x20' two story garage/shop (my property is very small). SinceI couldn't go wide, I went up. I'm assuming that you won't be putting on asecond floor but if you are, make sure that you design for the least amountto no vertical supports holding up the floor. I spanned the whole 20'.Much wider and I would have to had run a beam and a row of columns down themiddle of the space; not a good thing.Also, since my floor to ceiling was 7'-6", I am able to just reach thebottom of the ceiling. I put outlets on the ceiling so when I have mytablesaw or whatever in the middle of the room, I just go up... not acrossthe floor, over the bench, and behind the shelves. If the ceiling isn't lowenough to reach, run it up to 10' for the extra volume. You've alreadybought the floor and roof, a few extra feet of wall doesn't add much.If you are buying premanufactured roof trusses, talk to the lumber yard ormanufacturer and see if they have the "bonus space" style available.Essentially, the center of the truss will have a nice open square, maybe 4'wide, in the middle that you can drop a floor onto and use as extra storage.It's real nice to have plenty of outlets, mount them all at 48". Floorlevel outlets in a garage doesn't make much sense. Put the air compressoron it own circuit (preferably in someone else's garage, mine's making medeaf). Install at least one 220V welding outlet near the garage door, I'malways using my MIG to fix something that I can't get in the shop. Not tomention wood shaving and welding sparks don't mix. Put flood lights on theoutside to light up your outside work area. All outlets should be GFCIprotected and if it's three car or larger, it needs floor drains (andpossibly a grease separator) by BOCA and ICC code. I live in a small townwith no code enforcement, lucky me.If you are planning on insulating and paneling (you are obviously made ofmoney) use OSB for the bottom 4' and then drywall above. The OSB holds upbetter and the drywall is cheap. Painted white and covered with shelves andbenches, you won't notice the OSB. If you really have the coin, replace thedrywall with pegboard. A lawyer friend covered the whole inside of hisgarage with pine beadboard pegboard and had is stained... it looks beautifulbut a little overkill to hang an extension cord, a rake, and a broom.Lots of lights.Consider how you are going to heat it. If you are going to be in thereeight hours a day, five days a week, it makes sense to spend a little moremoney on a heating/cooling system and insulation. If it's just a few hoursa week, the insulation will never return the investment. Consider underslabradiant heat. If you are near, I have a two year old 140000btu boiler thatcame out of the house we are remodeling that I can sell you (I'm really justtrying to get it out of my shop). Any gas appliance in the space should besealed combustion, although I use a kerosene heater (obviously an exposedflame). Airborne sawdust in the right density is explosive and it'spossible to get there if the bag on your dust collector pops loose.Don't make it so nice that the wife and kids want to hang out in there. Andstay strong right from the begining that it will NOT be a place to storeChristmas decoration, the kids old toys, the treadmill that nobody uses,boxes and boxes of crap that should be thrown away or given to Goodwill.And you will need at least one Snap-On tool calendar (you know, the oneswhere there's a new girl each month holding a tool). It's wife repellant.Robert HainesDu Quoin, Illinois
Mike,I built a 20'x20' two story garage/shop (my property is very small). SinceI couldn't go wide, I went up. I'm assuming that you won't be putting on asecond floor but if you are, make sure that you design for the least amountto no vertical supports holding up the floor. I spanned the whole 20'.Much wider and I would have to had run a beam and a row of columns down themiddle of the space; not a good thing.Also, since my floor to ceiling was 7'-6", I am able to just reach thebottom of the ceiling. I put outlets on the ceiling so when I have mytablesaw or whatever in the middle of the room, I just go up... not acrossthe floor, over the bench, and behind the shelves. If the ceiling isn't lowenough to reach, run it up to 10' for the extra volume. You've alreadybought the floor and roof, a few extra feet of wall doesn't add much.If you are buying premanufactured roof trusses, talk to the lumber yard ormanufacturer and see if they have the "bonus space" style available.Essentially, the center of the truss will have a nice open square, maybe 4'wide, in the middle that you can drop a floor onto and use as extra storage.It's real nice to have plenty of outlets, mount them all at 48". Floorlevel outlets in a garage doesn't make much sense. Put the air compressoron it own circuit (preferably in someone else's garage, mine's making medeaf). Install at least one 220V welding outlet near the garage door, I'malways using my MIG to fix something that I can't get in the shop. Not tomention wood shaving and welding sparks don't mix. Put flood lights on theoutside to light up your outside work area. All outlets should be GFCIprotected and if it's three car or larger, it needs floor drains (andpossibly a grease separator) by BOCA and ICC code. I live in a small townwith no code enforcement, lucky me.If you are planning on insulating and paneling (you are obviously made ofmoney) use OSB for the bottom 4' and then drywall above. The OSB holds upbetter and the drywall is cheap. Painted white and covered with shelves andbenches, you won't notice the OSB. If you really have the coin, replace thedrywall with pegboard. A lawyer friend covered the whole inside of hisgarage with pine beadboard pegboard and had is stained... it looks beautifulbut a little overkill to hang an extension cord, a rake, and a broom.Lots of lights.Consider how you are going to heat it. If you are going to be in thereeight hours a day, five days a week, it makes sense to spend a little moremoney on a heating/cooling system and insulation. If it's just a few hoursa week, the insulation will never return the investment. Consider underslabradiant heat. If you are near, I have a two year old 140000btu boiler thatcame out of the house we are remodeling that I can sell you (I'm really justtrying to get it out of my shop). Any gas appliance in the space should besealed combustion, although I use a kerosene heater (obviously an exposedflame). Airborne sawdust in the right density is explosive and it'spossible to get there if the bag on your dust collector pops loose.Don't make it so nice that the wife and kids want to hang out in there. Andstay strong right from the begining that it will NOT be a place to storeChristmas decoration, the kids old toys, the treadmill that nobody uses,boxes and boxes of crap that should be thrown away or given to Goodwill.And you will need at least one Snap-On tool calendar (you know, the oneswhere there's a new girl each month holding a tool). It's wife repellant.Robert HainesDu Quoin, Illinois
Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "John Ford"
RE: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: Mike
What a bunch of great suggestions! This list is just great. I have beenthinking about my dream shop a lot lately and still picked up some greatideas.My shop will have a wood floor, so I can put electric outlets and sawdustsuction system in the floor. Wood is cheaper but more work than cement.One suggestion on the master switch by the door, put it high, at least 5 1/2feet, keeps it away from little hands.As we are talking dream shop here, it seems during construction it would beeasy to plumb a PVC air system through the shop and have outlets for air aswell as electricity.Skip________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 08:08:53 -0800
What a bunch of great suggestions! This list is just great. I have beenthinking about my dream shop a lot lately and still picked up some greatideas.My shop will have a wood floor, so I can put electric outlets and sawdustsuction system in the floor. Wood is cheaper but more work than cement.One suggestion on the master switch by the door, put it high, at least 5 1/2feet, keeps it away from little hands.As we are talking dream shop here, it seems during construction it would beeasy to plumb a PVC air system through the shop and have outlets for air aswell as electricity.Skip________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 08:08:53 -0800
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: Isablcorky(at)aol.com
Go ahead and double the size!!!!!At least design it so it can be added-on to later (roof pitched the rightway, etc.)bed>>________________________________________________________________________________
Go ahead and double the size!!!!!At least design it so it can be added-on to later (roof pitched the rightway, etc.)bed>>________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Mike B."
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shopFellow next door is building his dream shop. Started with a two bay car garage on the east side, 24X24, then the shop on the west side of the slab, 24X36w/ plumbing. THEN his wife said, we need a guest suite ( for the in-laws) so uphe went, apartment over shop, storage over garage w/ a lower roof. Then the wife said, dormer windows would look nice on the front side, sooooooooooo I'm hesitant to ask what this is costing but it will surely pan out as they are young and eager.It will be a very nice addition to our block. CMC in La________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 12:29:57 -0500
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shopFellow next door is building his dream shop. Started with a two bay car garage on the east side, 24X24, then the shop on the west side of the slab, 24X36w/ plumbing. THEN his wife said, we need a guest suite ( for the in-laws) so uphe went, apartment over shop, storage over garage w/ a lower roof. Then the wife said, dormer windows would look nice on the front side, sooooooooooo I'm hesitant to ask what this is costing but it will surely pan out as they are young and eager.It will be a very nice addition to our block. CMC in La________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 12:29:57 -0500
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Mike B."
Hi Mike,A friend of mine is having a shop built so I'll pass on these bits ofinformation. He put in electrical outlets every 3 feet in all the wallsabout 5 feet up from the floor. May be overkill but they will be handy. Heput every 6 outlets on a separate circuit. Also, don't skimp on insullationespecially if you use propane. Hope this helps.Lynn KnollWichita, Piet/Corvair builder----- Original Message -----
Hi Mike,A friend of mine is having a shop built so I'll pass on these bits ofinformation. He put in electrical outlets every 3 feet in all the wallsabout 5 feet up from the floor. May be overkill but they will be handy. Heput every 6 outlets on a separate circuit. Also, don't skimp on insullationespecially if you use propane. Hope this helps.Lynn KnollWichita, Piet/Corvair builder----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Mike B."
12/10/2003 12:46:42 PMIf you live in a cold climate I would frame the walls with 2x6 instead of2x4 this allowes more insulation and lower heating cost."Lynn & Doris Knoll" (at)matronics.com on 12/10/2003 12:29:14PMPlease respond to pietenpol-list(at)matronics.comSent by: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.comcc:Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shopHi Mike,A friend of mine is having a shop built so I'll pass on these bits ofinformation. He put in electrical outlets every 3 feet in all the wallsabout 5 feet up from the floor. May be overkill but they will be handy. Heput every 6 outlets on a separate circuit. Also, don't skimp on insullationespecially if you use propane. Hope this helps.Lynn KnollWichita, Piet/Corvair builder----- Original Message -----
12/10/2003 12:46:42 PMIf you live in a cold climate I would frame the walls with 2x6 instead of2x4 this allowes more insulation and lower heating cost."Lynn & Doris Knoll" (at)matronics.com on 12/10/2003 12:29:14PMPlease respond to pietenpol-list(at)matronics.comSent by: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.comcc:Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shopHi Mike,A friend of mine is having a shop built so I'll pass on these bits ofinformation. He put in electrical outlets every 3 feet in all the wallsabout 5 feet up from the floor. May be overkill but they will be handy. Heput every 6 outlets on a separate circuit. Also, don't skimp on insullationespecially if you use propane. Hope this helps.Lynn KnollWichita, Piet/Corvair builder----- Original Message -----
Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
RE: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Kent Hallsten"
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: Kent Hallsten
I'm not completely endorsing the use of PVC for 120psi lines, but I will say thatmy family's cabinet/furniture shop that we had back in the mid 80's had about2,500 ft of PVC air lines that went from the central compressor to all theassembly stations.... about 50 in all.... it worked for 7 years before we finallymoved out of that building..... never failed.I'm of the opinion that it'll work fine... but there's no argument that copperwould be better in the long run.DJ----- Original Message -----
I'm not completely endorsing the use of PVC for 120psi lines, but I will say thatmy family's cabinet/furniture shop that we had back in the mid 80's had about2,500 ft of PVC air lines that went from the central compressor to all theassembly stations.... about 50 in all.... it worked for 7 years before we finallymoved out of that building..... never failed.I'm of the opinion that it'll work fine... but there's no argument that copperwould be better in the long run.DJ----- Original Message -----
RE: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Mike B."
RE: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Kent Hallsten"
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Mike B."
Mike,I just thought of something, how about building a attached "dog house" withlots and lots of insulation for the air compressor. I get so tired ofhearing that %%$$####@ thing!----- Original Message -----
Mike,I just thought of something, how about building a attached "dog house" withlots and lots of insulation for the air compressor. I get so tired ofhearing that %%$$####@ thing!----- Original Message -----
RE: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Two things - It's impossible to have too many electrical outlets (ofsufficient current carrying ability) and it's impossible to have too muchlight. I have also found it useful to hang things from the ceiling joists(my workshop is in my basement), such as a come-along to hoist the engine,and also to hoist the fuselage while I built the gear under it.Obviously, you will want to make sure that you can get your project out oncecompleted, and you might want to consider ventilation if you will be doingcovering or painting in the shop. I have running water in mine which hasbeen useful.Jack -----Original Message-----
Two things - It's impossible to have too many electrical outlets (ofsufficient current carrying ability) and it's impossible to have too muchlight. I have also found it useful to hang things from the ceiling joists(my workshop is in my basement), such as a come-along to hoist the engine,and also to hoist the fuselage while I built the gear under it.Obviously, you will want to make sure that you can get your project out oncecompleted, and you might want to consider ventilation if you will be doingcovering or painting in the shop. I have running water in mine which hasbeen useful.Jack -----Original Message-----
RE: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Amen to that. My beer refrigerator in the shop has saved me many a trip upand down the stairs, plus it's a good place to stick all those stickers youcollect at OSH and SNF. Another thing I have that is useful is a phone inthe shop. Saves lots of trips upstairs. -----Original Message-----
Amen to that. My beer refrigerator in the shop has saved me many a trip upand down the stairs, plus it's a good place to stick all those stickers youcollect at OSH and SNF. Another thing I have that is useful is a phone inthe shop. Saves lots of trips upstairs. -----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: Roger & Kathy Green
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shopIn a message dated 12/10/03 4:02:40 PM Central Standard Time, dknoll(at)cox.net writes:>I'm building a new shop, in an old two car garage, and I am DEFINATELY going to locate the air compressor out side. I also have three rows of flourescent lights (the new 1" diameter kind that works in low temperatures) for the full length, each row on a switch. Never enough light, or recepticles. Concrete floor. Electric heat - no explosive fuels. Snap-On calender. Hummm....does anyone know where I can get an airplane calender, with bikini babes ?Chuck Gantzer________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 20:26:06 -0700
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shopIn a message dated 12/10/03 4:02:40 PM Central Standard Time, dknoll(at)cox.net writes:>I'm building a new shop, in an old two car garage, and I am DEFINATELY going to locate the air compressor out side. I also have three rows of flourescent lights (the new 1" diameter kind that works in low temperatures) for the full length, each row on a switch. Never enough light, or recepticles. Concrete floor. Electric heat - no explosive fuels. Snap-On calender. Hummm....does anyone know where I can get an airplane calender, with bikini babes ?Chuck Gantzer________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 20:26:06 -0700
Fwd: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: Clif Dawson
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: Clif Dawson
RE: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Kent Hallsten"
I agree with the two items that Kent mentioned:I owned a cabinet shop and we used PVC to distribute compressed air (we werea start-up and were working on the cheap). We had it blow, fortunatelyno-one was hurt, but it was a LOUD explosion. About ten feet of 1" lineturned into pieces up to 50' away. Our downfall was that the PVC wasconnected to the compressor directly and the vibration fatigued it. If youreally must use PVC, feed it with a rubber or vinyl line. For your sizeshop, you really don't need much more than one fat pipe with a couple ofquick-disconnects that you will plug your hose into anyway, so go steel.Also, PVC and plastic pipe will generate a static when used for dustcollection and needs to be grounded. We used galvanized HVAC pipe/ductworkfor our dust collection. The only piece of non-metalic pipe was a 10' long4" flexible line running to the CNC router and it had a copper wire spirallywrapped in it's construction. It was stripped at one end and connected tothe metal stuff. You knew when it wasn't because a spark would generatebetween the intake and the router bit (about a 1" jump) every second. Thiswas not our normal operation. If you do end up getting thatstick-it-to-a-shop-vac type dust collection from Home-Depot, find out how toground it properly.Robert HainesDu Quoin, IllinoisSubject: RE: Pietenpol-List: New shop
I agree with the two items that Kent mentioned:I owned a cabinet shop and we used PVC to distribute compressed air (we werea start-up and were working on the cheap). We had it blow, fortunatelyno-one was hurt, but it was a LOUD explosion. About ten feet of 1" lineturned into pieces up to 50' away. Our downfall was that the PVC wasconnected to the compressor directly and the vibration fatigued it. If youreally must use PVC, feed it with a rubber or vinyl line. For your sizeshop, you really don't need much more than one fat pipe with a couple ofquick-disconnects that you will plug your hose into anyway, so go steel.Also, PVC and plastic pipe will generate a static when used for dustcollection and needs to be grounded. We used galvanized HVAC pipe/ductworkfor our dust collection. The only piece of non-metalic pipe was a 10' long4" flexible line running to the CNC router and it had a copper wire spirallywrapped in it's construction. It was stripped at one end and connected tothe metal stuff. You knew when it wasn't because a spark would generatebetween the intake and the router bit (about a 1" jump) every second. Thiswas not our normal operation. If you do end up getting thatstick-it-to-a-shop-vac type dust collection from Home-Depot, find out how toground it properly.Robert HainesDu Quoin, IllinoisSubject: RE: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Mike B."
Use Scissor trusses instead of flat bottomed trusses so you have more headroom. Head room becomes a big issue.Where is this located? You may want to put plastic tube in the convrete fora radiant heating system.Chris Bobka----- Original Message -----
Use Scissor trusses instead of flat bottomed trusses so you have more headroom. Head room becomes a big issue.Where is this located? You may want to put plastic tube in the convrete fora radiant heating system.Chris Bobka----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Gadd, Skip"
It is best to use iron pipe or copper for the air so it cools the air andallows the water to condense out into droplets. Moisture traps can onlytrap drops, not vapor. If you don't get the moisture out in the pipe, thenit will surely condense when the pressure drops as it comes out of whateveryou are using the air for ie. into your paint or air tools etc.PVC is inherently poor since it is not resistant to oil which inevitablygets entrained in air unless you have an oilless compressor. It would bebad to have a PVC line burst when you are in the shop.Chris Bobka----- Original Message -----
It is best to use iron pipe or copper for the air so it cools the air andallows the water to condense out into droplets. Moisture traps can onlytrap drops, not vapor. If you don't get the moisture out in the pipe, thenit will surely condense when the pressure drops as it comes out of whateveryou are using the air for ie. into your paint or air tools etc.PVC is inherently poor since it is not resistant to oil which inevitablygets entrained in air unless you have an oilless compressor. It would bebad to have a PVC line burst when you are in the shop.Chris Bobka----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Mike"
Ideally, on the morning of day two of the concrete, cover the entire slabwith a continuous puddle of water and keep it full for a month. All theconrete must be covered. This will slow the curing and allow higheststrength to be developed.second best is to hose the slab down and then completely cover the slab withplastic sheet to keep the water from evaporating. Hose it down everydayand keep it drenched, especially in areas in the sun. Poly plastic ischeap.My 4000 PSI (30 day) compressive strength rated concrete was at about 3000PSI at 30 days, but then tested at 5800 at 60 days. SO it was worth it.chris----- Original Message -----
Ideally, on the morning of day two of the concrete, cover the entire slabwith a continuous puddle of water and keep it full for a month. All theconrete must be covered. This will slow the curing and allow higheststrength to be developed.second best is to hose the slab down and then completely cover the slab withplastic sheet to keep the water from evaporating. Hose it down everydayand keep it drenched, especially in areas in the sun. Poly plastic ischeap.My 4000 PSI (30 day) compressive strength rated concrete was at about 3000PSI at 30 days, but then tested at 5800 at 60 days. SO it was worth it.chris----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Kent Hallsten"
PVC is excellent for the vacuum system. You can run a bare copper wirethrough it to collect the static electricity. Just make sure it isgrounded.Sawdust is like grain in a grain elevator. When it is on the move andsuspended it is highly explosive, just like the new MOAB they tested.Chris----- Original Message -----
PVC is excellent for the vacuum system. You can run a bare copper wirethrough it to collect the static electricity. Just make sure it isgrounded.Sawdust is like grain in a grain elevator. When it is on the move andsuspended it is highly explosive, just like the new MOAB they tested.Chris----- Original Message -----
RE: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: dave rowe
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: Gnwac(at)cs.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shopMike, Thanks for the video tape. I just got the chance to watch it. A GREAT job on the BASSET HOUND production and the tons of resourceful constructiontips. Hope that you don't mind some of your ideas to be used. I know that I can turn to you and the list for info later on. I have never flown, heard or sat in a Piet, but boy you have lifted my spirits of what I can expect.Thanks again,Greg Menoche________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shopMike, Thanks for the video tape. I just got the chance to watch it. A GREAT job on the BASSET HOUND production and the tons of resourceful constructiontips. Hope that you don't mind some of your ideas to be used. I know that I can turn to you and the list for info later on. I have never flown, heard or sat in a Piet, but boy you have lifted my spirits of what I can expect.Thanks again,Greg Menoche________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: "Barry Davis"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop While considering the shop idea and reading responses for a couple of days, I have seen many steel sheds or pole barns as they are called in our area with a transparent ribbed material that is about 24 "in height just under the roof's edge. With all the talk of lighting, why pay for something that we canget for free.Greg Menoche________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop While considering the shop idea and reading responses for a couple of days, I have seen many steel sheds or pole barns as they are called in our area with a transparent ribbed material that is about 24 "in height just under the roof's edge. With all the talk of lighting, why pay for something that we canget for free.Greg Menoche________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By:
Remember - No Insulation in the skylight areas. Decide which you can livewith - Heating/Cooling cost or Lighting cost. You have to pay one or theother, there are no free lunches.----- Original Message -----
Remember - No Insulation in the skylight areas. Decide which you can livewith - Heating/Cooling cost or Lighting cost. You have to pay one or theother, there are no free lunches.----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: New shop
Original Posted By: Clif Dawson
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shopIn a message dated 12/12/03 3:41:29 PM Central Standard Time, Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov writes:>That was the best 'White Knuckles' flying I've ever done !! It seemed like Pietenpols were everywhere !! That evening was definately the highlight of mytrip to Brodhead / Oshkosh. Next summer, we need to flight plan a formation to do a couple of fly bys, with a camara plane. Mike C., weren't you and Steve E. on 'Dawn Patrol' in '99 ? I understand you guys woke everybody up at about 5:30 or 6:00 am.Chuck G.________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2003 00:17:24 -0800
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New shopIn a message dated 12/12/03 3:41:29 PM Central Standard Time, Michael.D.Cuy(at)grc.nasa.gov writes:>That was the best 'White Knuckles' flying I've ever done !! It seemed like Pietenpols were everywhere !! That evening was definately the highlight of mytrip to Brodhead / Oshkosh. Next summer, we need to flight plan a formation to do a couple of fly bys, with a camara plane. Mike C., weren't you and Steve E. on 'Dawn Patrol' in '99 ? I understand you guys woke everybody up at about 5:30 or 6:00 am.Chuck G.________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2003 00:17:24 -0800