Re: Pietenpol-List: landings

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Original Posted By: "Mike Whaley"
I have followed the flow of replies to the question of how to land aPietenpol. They were all excellent and on point. If I might be so bold, Iwould like to take this opportunity to consolidate the advice into one placewhere others in the future might look and also benefit from our experience.I welcome comments and will incorporate any suggestions that clarify theanswer.My background is that I fly and have around 400 hours in an Aircamper. I ampresently instructing in a Cessna 140 that I own. I earned my flightcertificate in 1964 in a Cessna 140. Over 2/3 of my hours are in a taildragger. I am an EAA Flight Advisor and am in the process of doing theFirst Flight in two new Aircampers and hopefully mine later this spring.Attached is how it looked New Years day.First some basics. In generic terms a good 3 point landing consists of anapproach that concludes with a round out, a flare and a greaser of alanding. A standard approach is done by flying the aircraft at a constantpre-determined airspeed (that is usually around 1.3 times faster thanstall). I have been very successful in holding that speed solely with theuse of pitch (using the elevators). The angle of the approach is controlledwith power. This approach speed is carried to an altitude near the groundwhen the aircraft is pitched up to an attitude that results in nearly levelflight. This part of the landing is commonly called the round out. Sincepitching up results in a decrease in airspeed, the wings start to lose somelift. What follows is what determines the quality of the touchdown and iscalled the flare. The trick is to slowly pitch up at the precise rate toequally compensate for the loss of lift from the decrease in airspeed. Ifyou have been paying attention, you realize that this is a constantlychanging situation. As you pitch up you decrease speed, which decreaseslift, which requires more pitch, which requires ... The object is to slowdown from approach speed to stall speed, maintaining almost level flight,while allowing the aircraft wheels to ease closer to the runway until theytouch down at the exact moment stall speed is attained. At the moment oftouchdown the elevator control should be back as far as it will travel.This securely forces the tail wheel down and increases its effectiveness incontrolling direction. This is very important since the rudder quicklyloses effect because of loss of air flowing past it as it slows. I won'tcomment here on the importance of keeping a tail dragger going straightwhile on the ground, other than to say it is the most important aspect offlying one. Now, back to landing, if you get to the stall speed beforetouching the ground the plane loses all lift and drops to the ground. Not abad landing if the drop is a matter of inches. If the ground is touchedbefore slowing to stall speed a return to flight is likely. This isespecially true in a tail dragger because the pitch angle of the wing isusually set for a climb when all wheels are on the ground. If you areflying above stall speed in all likely hood you will touch down on the maingear first. As you pull back the tail will lower, creating more lift, andyou find yourself climbing back into the air.In most aircraft the round out and flare are distinct segments of thelanding. The round out might take around 5 seconds and the following flaremight take 15 to 20 seconds depending on airspeed at the start of the roundout. Cessnas seem to float forever.Now for Aircamper specific observations. This is what it looks like for mein the pilot's seat. For many reasons the Aircamper doesn't float much.It has a lot of drag. It doesn't go very fast in the first place and slowsquickly upon reduction of power. Therefore the round out and flare happenso quickly that they become one operation. If enough speed is not carriedin the approach the elevators become ineffective before completing the roundout/flare and the bungee cords get severely tested. One of the things youneed to discover is the minimum approach speed that still allows elevatorcontrol until full stall and touchdown. This is going to probably bedifferent for each aircraft because of configuration, instrument error,etc.. 65 mph works for me. 1.3 stall speed is 55 mph. I pancake in everytime at that speed. I "aim" at the ground and carry 65 mph until a coupleof feet above the ground and then smoothly pull back for the round out/flareand am on the ground in about 30 - 50 feet. No bounce. No drop. Just asmooth 3 point landing.I would suggest that one of the first things to establish on the firstflight is the stall speed. I would then suggest that the approach be testedat no slower than 1.6 times stall speed. If that gives elevator control butresults in a distinct flare you could reduce the speed in 2 mph steps untilyou find the speed that causes mild elevator loss. You now know the minimumapproach speed for your plane in that weight configuration. I usually add acouple of mph for an adult passenger.This is a conservative approach to coming up with numbers you can fly with.Although I have only flown my own Aircamper to date, I believe fromlistening to others' experiences that this is the best way to approach yourfirst landings. What do you say Mike Cuy or Chris?I met a list member at Oshkosh in 1999. He had completed his plane in Aprilbut didn't have it with him. He told me that on the third landing he bentthe landing gear on a hard touchdown because he ran out of elevator.Hopefully this discussion will prevent a repeat of that experience.All of the above only applies to a power off landing. Carrying a littlepower allows a slightly slower approach speed and still provides elevatorcontrol during the flare. Cut power at the end of the round out and end upwith a perfect 3 point landing.Hope this helps someone. Sorry this got so long. It is easier to do thandescribe.Ted BrousseauPS If any of the above does not make sense don't try it alone. Run out andget yourself an experienced taildragger pilot to help you. Also, this doesnot address crosswind, upwind, uphill, downhill, short field, soft field orwheel landings.________________________________________________________________________________

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Original Posted By: Fred Weaver
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: landings

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Original Posted By: Graham Hansen
[This message didn't go through for some reason, so I am re-sendingit again as a forwarded message.]----- Original Message -----

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Original Posted By: "Hodgson, Mark O"
Well, I think it's just about the best one I've seen....."The Pasture Pilot's Pride & Joy" was published in 1965 and it's a great articleabout the Pietenpol Air Camper with some mention of the Sky Scout......This is a good one......If you'll go into your browser's internet options and disable "Automatic ImageResizing", the pages will display in a size that you can print on your printerat just about the same quality as the original. Or you can save the file toyour local drive.It's in the File Library section of mykitplane.com:EnjoyJM________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: landingsDate: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 12:54:50 -0500

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Original Posted By: Rick Holland

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Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy