Original Posted By: Dan Yocum
Pietenpol-List: undercamber
Re: Pietenpol-List: undercamber
Original Posted By: airlion
Re: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step
Original Posted By: Ryan Mueller
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step
Re: Pietenpol-List: undercamber
Original Posted By: steve emo
ChrisWhat type of Mitsubishi motor is it, what did you have to do for the conversionand do you have dual ignition, either low tension or high tension?Great video and a fantastic project, do you have web pictures?CheersJohn (UK)--------The only way is UPRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2011 08:19:12 -0400Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: undercamber
ChrisWhat type of Mitsubishi motor is it, what did you have to do for the conversionand do you have dual ignition, either low tension or high tension?Great video and a fantastic project, do you have web pictures?CheersJohn (UK)--------The only way is UPRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2011 08:19:12 -0400Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: undercamber
Pietenpol-List: Re: undercamber
Original Posted By: "Jack Phillips"
Gardiner,To "fill in" the bottom of the wing you are changing the aerodynamic characteristicsof the airfoil, and if you do that, you are becoming your own aeronauticalengineer and test pilot at the same time. You do not know for sure the flightcharacteristics of the airfoil on your Piet, as it is no longer the FC-10 airfoil.By filling it in you are creating an entirely new airfoil, The airlionXXX. Seriously, though , if you don't like the look of the airfoil then findan already designed and flight tested airfoil that you do like the look of andbuild that. But my suggestion would be to leave well enough alone. Just my $.02.For a good discussion of "undercamber" airfoils, go to the following link-http://www.djaerotech.com/dj_askjd/dj_q ... ber.htmlIt is a really good discussion of the camber of airfoils, but I will paste themost interesting paragraph of the link above-"The tricky thing about both camber and thickness is that too much of either cangive us an airfoil that has too much curvature on one or both surfaces for theairflow to follow smoothly, particularly at low Reynolds numbers (such as ourslowfliers), and particularly on the portions of the airfoil aft of the highestand/or thickest points. If we have too much camber and/or thickness, theairflow over the aft portions of the upper surface can separate at higher anglesof attack (limiting our slow speed performance and max lift), while too muchundercamber can cause flow separations on the lower surface at lower anglesof attack. With too much of both, we can get an airfoil that has significant amountsof separated flow on the top, bottom or both at ALL angles of attack. However,not enough of each can also cause problems. Designing really good airfoils,especially for very low Reynolds numbers, can become very tricky."Sorry I did not get to see you at Triple Tree, but glad you met Tim and Neil. Ihope to see you at CC#21 if I can bid my schedule around it for November. Hopeto meet you then.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Gardiner,To "fill in" the bottom of the wing you are changing the aerodynamic characteristicsof the airfoil, and if you do that, you are becoming your own aeronauticalengineer and test pilot at the same time. You do not know for sure the flightcharacteristics of the airfoil on your Piet, as it is no longer the FC-10 airfoil.By filling it in you are creating an entirely new airfoil, The airlionXXX. Seriously, though , if you don't like the look of the airfoil then findan already designed and flight tested airfoil that you do like the look of andbuild that. But my suggestion would be to leave well enough alone. Just my $.02.For a good discussion of "undercamber" airfoils, go to the following link-http://www.djaerotech.com/dj_askjd/dj_q ... ber.htmlIt is a really good discussion of the camber of airfoils, but I will paste themost interesting paragraph of the link above-"The tricky thing about both camber and thickness is that too much of either cangive us an airfoil that has too much curvature on one or both surfaces for theairflow to follow smoothly, particularly at low Reynolds numbers (such as ourslowfliers), and particularly on the portions of the airfoil aft of the highestand/or thickest points. If we have too much camber and/or thickness, theairflow over the aft portions of the upper surface can separate at higher anglesof attack (limiting our slow speed performance and max lift), while too muchundercamber can cause flow separations on the lower surface at lower anglesof attack. With too much of both, we can get an airfoil that has significant amountsof separated flow on the top, bottom or both at ALL angles of attack. However,not enough of each can also cause problems. Designing really good airfoils,especially for very low Reynolds numbers, can become very tricky."Sorry I did not get to see you at Triple Tree, but glad you met Tim and Neil. Ihope to see you at CC#21 if I can bid my schedule around it for November. Hopeto meet you then.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: undercamber
Original Posted By: steve emo
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: undercamber
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: undercamber
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: undercamber
Original Posted By: Steve Emo
I was told by a very good friend of Bernie's that He had actually tried an airfoilwith no undercamber. He tried the clark Y airfoil and was not pleased withthe performance. He thought that he could design an airfoil that would performbetter. He experimented with a number of airfoils. He designed the airfoiland concluded that it performed better than the Clark Y that was used on similar" ships ".Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: undercamber
I was told by a very good friend of Bernie's that He had actually tried an airfoilwith no undercamber. He tried the clark Y airfoil and was not pleased withthe performance. He thought that he could design an airfoil that would performbetter. He experimented with a number of airfoils. He designed the airfoiland concluded that it performed better than the Clark Y that was used on similar" ships ".Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: undercamber
Re: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step
Original Posted By: helspersew(at)aol.com
> Looks good....just curious....which plans> page has the step on it? I think I forgot to order that one,> just want to pick up a copy from the family...thanks,> Ryan> > > On Mon, Sep 19, 2011 at 11:33 PM, KM Heide CPO/FAAOP > wrote:> > > Members:> Here are some photos> I made of my step which I created last year. The key here is> light wall tubing slid inside another tube. The buttons are> called step buttons found in aluminum canes or crutches.> They will allow for my step to slide out and lock into the> correct 6" length. Then push the button in and they> slide back into the sleeve. I placed this set-up as as far> back as I could under my seat. Used small pieces of ash> bolted through my 1/4" thick floor!> > So now... flame away> as I added MORE weight to the rear of the fuse! I will have> the nicest easy to get into..outside control horned..looking> Pietenpol "brick" in the country! However, I> am keeping it to plans!> > KMHeide> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step
> Looks good....just curious....which plans> page has the step on it? I think I forgot to order that one,> just want to pick up a copy from the family...thanks,> Ryan> > > On Mon, Sep 19, 2011 at 11:33 PM, KM Heide CPO/FAAOP > wrote:> > > Members:> Here are some photos> I made of my step which I created last year. The key here is> light wall tubing slid inside another tube. The buttons are> called step buttons found in aluminum canes or crutches.> They will allow for my step to slide out and lock into the> correct 6" length. Then push the button in and they> slide back into the sleeve. I placed this set-up as as far> back as I could under my seat. Used small pieces of ash> bolted through my 1/4" thick floor!> > So now... flame away> as I added MORE weight to the rear of the fuse! I will have> the nicest easy to get into..outside control horned..looking> Pietenpol "brick" in the country! However, I> am keeping it to plans!> > KMHeide> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step