Brodhead Pietenpol Association

Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
Pieters-There was a very interesting (simple, cheap) smoke system written up in last month's EAA Experimenter by the designer of the Legal Eagle, Leonard Milholland. It features an empty propane bottle like you use on a camp stove or brazing torch. He fitted a Schrader (bicycle tire) valve to it, fills it about 3/4 full with oil and then pressurizes it with compressed air from his shop, and goes flying. He uses the knob/valve that comes with the bottle to control the flow of smoke oil. It seems somewhat easier to operate than the hand-pumped fertilizer sprayer method.Oscar ZunigaSan Antonio, TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.netThe new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 09:03:12 -0500

Original Posted By: "Jim Markle"
Howdy, Pieters;I'm working on a smoke system for 41CC but in the meantime, for you smoke fanatics who can handle video clips, you can take a look at a different type of smoke system here (it's about a 1MB file): http://www.flysquirrel.net/Babypowder.mpegIf you've ever been around infants, you'll understand this (I'm from a family of 10 kids myself).Oscar ZunigaSan Antonio, TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: "Oscar Zuniga"
My neighbors are wondering what all the laughing is about....This is great.....Reminds me of some of the other not so pleasent "oops" occurances I've experienced during "the process".....this is MUCH more tolerable.....jm----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
I know that those of you with smoke systems have different approaches (single-port, multi-port, etc.) and would like to hear a bit about endurance. Mike Cuy's system has a single injection port into one exhaust stack from a hand-pumped lawn sprayer arrangement. I think Chuck's system is multi-port. What I'm wondering about is how far a given amount of smoke oil will go. Some measure of "smoke minutes per quart" or something to give me an indication of how large a smoke reservoir to go with.I'm going single-port on my system. I like the looks of the "chain of puffs" smoke that Mike's system puts out, and assume that the picture at http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/smoke02.jpg is a picture of Mike's plane in action?Oscar ZunigaSan Antonio, TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net________________________________________________________________________________Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 10:12:08 -0500

Original Posted By: PIETLARS29(at)wmconnect.com
Oscar,This site doesn't mention anything about tank capacity or "fuel economy",but is informative nonetheless.http://www.kcdawnpatrol.org/smoke.htmBi ... __________

Original Posted By: Mark Blackwell
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: smoke systemsOscar,I'm smoking both pipes !! It's so much fun, it's probably illegal !! Originally, I installed an after-market windshield washer tank (probably a little over a quart), and pump, on the left upper portion of the engine mount,isolated with rubber strips and a custom built bracket. The pump was mounted to the tank, with a short hose from the tank to the pump, then from the pump tothe squirters. I use a hose from the pump to a brass Tee mounted on the center part of the engine mount, then branch it via brass compression fittingsand tubing, to the two fittings on the aft exhaust pipes, which are about 1" below the flange. I cut a 1/8" pipe coupler in half, and welded each half to theexhaust pipes pointing inboard. After welding, I drilled one #60 hole throughthe pipe, in the lower portion of the fitting, so oil would not puddle in the fitting. I operate the pump via a push button switch mounted on the power lever. This tank of a special blend of oil (Baby Oil) lasted about 3 minutes ofcontinuos smoke, if left on. I had 3 squawks with this original configuration:1) It was about level with the fittings on the exhaust pipes, and would dribble out, loosing the precious oil, and emitting a very slight smoke all thetime there was any oil left.2) Sometimes the pump would cavitate, and wouldn't pick up the fluid.3) The tank wasn't Big Enough !! The fix for all 3 squawks was to build a larger fiberglass tank (almost a gallon), and mount it down low, and centered on the firewall. Now, I've never used an entire tank of oil in a single flight. On a calm evening, I keep some power in on final approach, and put it into a slip, level off just above the runway, go full power for a high speed flyby (about 70 mph) and into a fairly steep departure, level off and make a turn. The smoke hangs there in 4 straight lines with an arc at the end. Another favorite use, is to hold one brake in the infield, and with 1/4 power, hit thesmoke, and do some doughnuts on the ground. The plane disappears behind a smoke screen, while everyone enjoys the aroma of baby oil !! Sometimes peopleask me if I can do Skywriting...I say "Yes, I can write the big O in the sky !!" Terry B. got an excellent straight on picture of my plane climbing out of Tick Hill, and from the camera angle, it looks like she's emitting plumes of Rocket Smoke, and going Straight Up !! Hey Mike C. - I hope we can do a few flybys at Brodhead, wing tip to wing tip, Smokin' the whole runway !! YEEEE HAAAAWW !! - now THAT would be a good video clip...Chuck G.p.s. Johnson & Johnson would go broke, if they supplied all the baby oil I need, and there wouldn't be any baby oil left for the baby's !!________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 10:02:24 -0500

Original Posted By: Mark Blackwell

Original Posted By: Matt Dralle
Boy, this list is quiet! Guess I'll ask a question for those of you who use the windshield washer pump approach on your smoke system. I think Chuck "Baby Oil" Gantzer uses a portable battery or a rechargeable battery to power the 12V setup on Seven Zero Charlie Golf.My question is, how long will the battery operate the windshield washer pump before requiring a recharge? Once per flight? Several flights (tankfuls)? And is the battery a motorcycle type or dry type?Smoke on!Oscar ZunigaSan Antonio, TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net_________________________________________________________________Get today's hot entertainment gossip http://movies.msn.com/movies/hotgossip? ... ______Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 22:12:23 -0800

Original Posted By: "Oscar Zuniga"
Oscar.Where can I get the plans for the a smoke system for my Piet?ThanksGene----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]"
Hi Bill,Welcome to the list. The Piet is a great project.Pietenpol designed 3 different wood fuselages. From shortest to longest,they are the Flying & Glider, the Orrin Hoopman 1934 Improved, and theCorvair. The 1934 are the plans you buy from Don Pietenpol and is 13'7"long firewall to tailpost. The Corvair is a supplament plan you can alsobuy from Don Pietenpol, it is 14'4 3/8" long, 2 7/8" longer in the aft bayat the tailpost and 2 1/2" longer in the bay ahead of the aft bay, 2''longer in the pilot pit and 2" longer in the first bay behind the firewall.The Flying & Glider is 2" shorter than the 1934, all in the first baybehind the firewall, making it 13'5" long. Skip> A lurker joins the fray.> I understand that Mr. Pietenpol's Corvair Air Camper was 6.5 incheslonger > than the original. The question I ask, "Where is the additional 6.5inches > put into the fuselage?"> Bill Weir________________________________________________________________________________Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: smoke systemsDate: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 09:20:43 -0600

Original Posted By: Tim Verthein

Original Posted By: Roger & Barb
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: How to pronounce Pietenpol?Me too. I think it's pronounced pete in pole________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 12:13:54 -0500 (GMT-05:00)

Original Posted By: "Gene & Tammy"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: smoke systemsHey Oscar / Gene, et All,The smoke system I have has proved to be very reliable, and the only maintenance has been to recharge the battery about 4 or 5 times a summer...Oh yeah,every once in a while ya gotta fill 'er up with either Baby Oil, or your favorite white mineral oil. My smoke system consists of an after-market windshield washer pump and originally I had the aftermarket tank, plumbing to each exhaust pipe, and wiringto the switch on the power lever. I isolated / mounted the tank on the upper left motor mount tubing, with a couple layers of rubber strap. I routed the clear tubing to a Tee fitting secured in rubber, to the engine mount, then used 1/8" brass tubing to each of the fittings in the exhaust pipes. I laid outthe route of the tubing, marked the pipes, and removed both exhaust pipes. I cut a 1/8" pipe coupler in half, radiused each half to the radius of the pipe,and oxy / accy welded them to the aft pipe of each side. After welded, I drilled one #60 hole through the exhaust pipes. I placed these holes toward thebottom edge of the fittings, theorizing that if oil would lay in there it would gum up. The switch is a push on / push off button, that is mounted rightto the throttle handle. This location allows me to work the smoke without taking my hand off the throttle. I originally thought it would only smoke goodat full power, but came to find I don't need much over 1/4 throttle to Smoke 'Em Up !! I can smoke 'em while taxiing, without any problem !! My exhaust pipespoint down and away from the fuselage, and even when all the oil doesn't vaporize, the fuselage hardly gets anything on it. I had a couple of squawks on the original system, that I have taken care of. 1.) I mounted the tank at about the same level as the fittings on the exhaust pipes, and it always dribbles out the pipes, with a little bit of smokeas a result. Over a period of a couple of hours, it will drain the tank, but I usually 'Smoke em up' before that happens.2.) When I ran the tank empty, and refill it, the pump would cavitate because of the way the line ran from the bottom of the tank to the pump, and Iwould always have to prime the pump, by blowing in the top of the tank. I gotsome strange looks from folks, while I performed this operation !!3.) The tank was too small. It only was big enough to do about 3 smoke runs. I would like to put about a 5 gallon bucket up there on the firewall, butI don't have enough room !!4.) I had to remove the top cowling to re-fill the tank. I built a new tank out of fiberglass / West System resin, with a fill tube out to the rightside of the cowling. It is mounted lower on the firewall. This will take careof all the squawks.5.) I now have been using the new smoke tank, but I have a small leak in the tank. I used West Systems resin for the fiberglass tank, and evidently I didn't get the seam sealed up good enough. I've never had that problem when Iused polyester resin, but it kicks very quickly. The West System gives some time, but it is also quite a bit more expensive. I fixed the leak, and it hasbeen trouble free ever since. I have some good pictures and explainations on my web site:http://nx770cg.com/SmokeSystem.htmlChuck G.NX770CG________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: "Oscar Zuniga"
Chuck: you had me at the first sentence. All I asked was how long the battery lasted between charges-! All that other good stuff was, as Mikee pointed out, on both your website and your fun DVD.I reassembled my carb with the new venturi today, fired up the engine and it ran STRONG. What a joy to run the A65. Wings should be back on the airplane soon...Oscar ZunigaSan Antonio, TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net_________________________________________________________________Live Search! ________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: "taildrags"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: GPS and ChartsI second Ja k Phillips on the belt and suspenders approach. Using a sectional in a Piet cockpit requires some forethought. You need to fold it before you fly so that you can sort of unroll it as you go. Trying to refold one with all the wind in the cockpit is pretty impossible. The trip-tics work great on a kneeboard.But, if you have to divert for weather, like I did last summer flying to Brodhead, you may end up flying off the trip-tics you prepared. I had an old Garmin 90 as backup, and sectionals which I refolded for each new leg of the trip. It worked ok and I was glad to have the GPS along. Good thing about it was it used AA batteries and ran about 12 hours on 4 of them. Wish the screen wasn't half shot. Matt PaxtonNX629MLConnected by DROID on Verizon Wireless________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: smoke systems

Original Posted By: "Jack Phillips"
I was wondering if I was the only one who had experienced the oil-mist mess. Ihave only run my smoke system once, on the ground, and not in final configuration.I ran it with baby oil and it made big, beautiful streams of smoke outthe starboard exhaust stack but then left a fine mist of baby oil on the side,tail, and belly of the airplane and left the grass under the airplane well oiled;o) I figured that in flight, the slipstream would take the smoke away quickerbut maybe there is just no way to avoid some oil if you're gonna smoke.--------Oscar ZunigaMedford, ORAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"A75 powerRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
I've learned through experience to not run my smoke system on the ground -it just messes up the airplane. If I do it in flight, I get a little oil onthe right landing gear, but that's about it.I run used automatic transmission fluid in my smoke system. Smokes as wellas baby oil but considerably cheaper (it's free - just go to any transmisionshop and they are happy to give the stuff away). Just be sure to strain itbefore pouring it in your tank - my system is clogged right now and I needto pull it apart and clean out the junk. I forgot to strain it the lasttime I re-filled it.Beautiful day to fly today. I flew the Pietenpol over to New London,looking for Matt Paxton, but missed him. 68 degrees, 50+ miles visibility,glass smooth air and no wind. It just doesn't get any better than that inNovember.Then I took the RV-4 up and did some (for me) hard aerobatics - loops,aileron rolls and hammerheads. Great little airplane. People are alwaysasking me which is my favorite, and I usually answer "whichever one I'mflying at the moment".Now back to work on building the house.Jack PhillipsNX899JPSmith Mountain Lake, Virginia-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: "Peter W Johnson"
Jack; the baby oil was just for my trial run because it was easy to get and handy.After you posted about the transmission fluid sometime ago, I inquired atthe place where I used to work (they do automotive research) and was rewardedwith a 5 gallon container of fresh transmission fluid. They draw test samplesfrom the batch and the rest gets recycled. I will recycle it through my smokesystem ;o) Thanks for reminding me what that container of oil was for.--------Oscar ZunigaMedford, ORAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"A75 powerRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: "bubbleboy"
Hi Guys,I am still awaiting delivery of my GN1 plans but have been making progresson the tail post repair on the Piet.Does anyone have a copy (scanned or otherwise) of the plan of tail post areaon the GN1 fuselage? I need to position the bracing wire bracket and thetailwheel attach bolt.CheersPeterWonthaggi Australiahttp://repiet.cpc-world.com________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: GN1 Tail Wheel/Tail Post

Original Posted By: "Douwe Blumberg"
Oscar,If you're getting unburned oil on your plane, I wonder if the orifice is abit too large and letting more oil in than gets burned, OR running thesystem at higher rpms might give you a more complete burn. Douwe________________________________________________________________________________