Brodhead Pietenpol Association

Original Posted By: Tim Willis

Original Posted By: Ben Ramler
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Landing Gear strengthI am intending to use Cub-type split LG, except for crossed tube and diesprings, instead of bungees. I have talked with a few people who have had hard or bad landings inPiets. In all cases something snapped in their LG. In at least one casethe mains held, but a part of the spring X-member snapped, causing theright LG to splay out. As you know collapsing LG can break the prop, a wing or two, or evencrack a longeron. I think we all have at least one hard landing in ourfuture, whether from a forced or unscheduled landing, strong or highlyvariable winds, poor visibility, or skillset problems. I am looking for alittle insurance here. Does anyone have recommendations for beefing up the LG? What has anyonedone in this regard? What would you do differently with this in mind? Thanks.---------------------------------________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 08:53:35 -0800 (PST)

Original Posted By: Hans Vander Voort
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: heightI flew a guy who was at least 250. ROC was a little slow but I never had any doubt it would fly. My plane is about 625 empty and powered with a Corvair. The day I flew the guy was about 80 F with about 10 gal. fuel. Runway was grass, 2400 ft. long JIM________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Landing Gear strength

Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
Tim,I have the setup as you described, original Pietenpol split landing gearwith compression spring in place of bungees.I have the same concern is it really strong enough?Although it's my own welding quality that I question most.So far only about 15 hours flying with about 30 or more Landings (shortflights and some Touch and Go's)But one of-field landing in a freshly harvest cornfield, no stalks just 6to 8 inch ruts, and I landed across the ruts.Some bouncy landings, flaring to soon and stalling a foot or so high.So far nothing bend or broken.When I have made a less than smooth landing I will inspect the landing gearfor cracks or other distortions.Plus every few flights you typically end up cleaning the landing gear and ainspection goes with it.I believe the design is pretty sound.The only recommendation that I can give you: make strong welding, twolayers if needed.And stress relief the welding afterwards.Plus Inspect frequently specially during the test phaseHans________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2006 13:16:13 -0500

Original Posted By: "walt evans"
Harvey,Follow the link:http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/filesL ... bumID=75Or if the link does not work go to mykitplane.com, under files section andmy name you can find the same fileHans________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2006 15:07:00 -0500

Original Posted By: Rick Holland

Original Posted By: "gcardinal"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: heightThe real question is not just what the front can carry but what the total loadis? I understand there's weight and balance to be figured out but if consideredon weight alone, what's the max the plane can safely fly? I'm 200 lbs andwould like to carry passengers around the same weight if possible... I'm sureit's different with different powerplants so if people can speak to that, itwould be interesting. Tom B.________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: "tmbrant1(at)netzero.com"
Last summer we flew NX18235 as follows:Empty weight - 616#Engine A-65Pilot - 225#Passenger - 200#Fuel - 90#Baggage - 60#Temp about 80 - 85FIt climbed about 200 - 250 fpm with a somewhat coarse prop.Greg CardinalP.S. Ben Ramler, I've been trying to contact you off list.----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By: "Kenneth M. Heide"

Original Posted By: Kenneth M. Heide
Keith:Clarks corvairs is where you go.http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/pages.c ... Dhomethere are a few others if you google, you'll find them.you also will want to sign up on the corvaircrafters buletin board.here is the directions on that one.http://www.krnet.org/corvaircraft_inst.htmlif you go to;http://mylist.net/listinfo/CorvAircraft ... rcraft/you can find a wealth of info on the corvaircrafters archivesmichael silviusscarborough, maine ----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By: walt evans
Hey WaltThere were some pics on the list last winter sometime as part of a discussionon cold weather flying. I'll start going thru archives as I get a chance.Dick N ----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By: "Mark Blackwell"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Need informationKen,The blue bosch coil you can get from JCWhitney, see link:_http://www.jcwhitney.com/autoparts/Search?cata ... hbtn.y=10_ (http://www.jcwhitney.com/autoparts/Sear ... rchbtn.y10) All other ignition parts, sparkplug wires and coil switcher, from Summit racing, see link;_http://www.summitracing.com/_ (http://www.summitracing.com/) Of course Clarks for all corvair engine parts_http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/main_ (http://www.corvair.com/user-cgi/main) Hope this helps.Hans________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2006 23:13:08 -0500

Original Posted By: BARNSTMR(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: heightIn a message dated 2/17/2006 11:18:38 AM Central Standard Time,ben_ramler2002(at)yahoo.com writes:When you say weight is an issue what would you or others say the max weightwould be for someone sitting in the front?I use a limited length on the front seat belt...If ya can't get it buckled,you're too fat to go !! :)Actually, last summer, I had a passenger in there that weighed 240 lbs, andhe's about 6' 2". He had to really 'suck in the gut' to get the belt buckled,but he finally got it, and after 3 high speed taxi runs down the hard surfacerunway to see how the plane handled, off we went !! The Density Altitude was2500', the temp was about 80=BA, and I had about a half load of fuel (10 gal.).It was a shallow climb rate, but the plane handled normally, during the 25minute flight. It's really a lot of fun to see how enthusiastic my passengersare. I've probably had about 50 or 60 passengers, and every one of them reallyloved it !! I recently acquired a pair of headsets with a built inintercom, but have yet to use it in flight. Should open a whole new realm ofenjoyment, now that I can use voice communication with my passenger...as opposedtohand signals !! I don't have the controls in the front cockpit, so I can moreeasily carry all the stuff for extended cross country flight, and besidesthat...I'm just not ready for my passenger to kill me !! As rule of thumb: You should be at 70% of the take off velocity, by the timeyou reach 50% of the available runway...if not, pull power, and you haveplenty of runway to get 'er stopped.Chuck G.NX770CG________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: Tim Willis strategyguy536(at)yahoo.com
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Landing Gear strengthTom,I picked up N-1033B a couple years ago wrecked and cheap because theoriginal builder under-engineered the cub style gear and didn't include thenecessary stop cables so the gear tubes wouldn't expand beyond the bungeesmax strength. Couple recommendations----never ever undersize the bungeesand their attachments to the gear, use the exact system the cub uses withthe exact oversized bungees. You may get a little harder bounce onlanding, but you can learn to grease landings, you cannot substituteunderengineering for saving a few hunderd bucks on this part of the plane. The guy who put the most money into building N-1033B lost his investment tome for rebuilding due to an engine failure and an unexpected off-fieldlanding that would have been sucessful if the gear had not expanded too faroutboard and he didn't have safety stop cables. Wreck caused bent struts,wings and longerons. Gordon BowenOriginal Message:-----------------

Original Posted By: "John and Phyllis Smoyer"

Original Posted By: Rcaprd(at)aol.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: I think you meant this message for someone else - or maybe the list in general.Too bad you can't make Brodhead though - it's a great time.Tom B.________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: Larry Nelson

Original Posted By: "Rick Holland"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Landing Gear strengthIn a message dated 4/16/2006 10:22:01 AM Central Standard Time, at7000ft(at)gmail.com writes:A related question I posted a while back and didn't see any reply to was about the addition of a safety cable (for split type gear) to prevent the gearfrom totally collapsing. Anyone seen this on a Piet?RIck H.Happy Easter to All !!Rick, The safety cable is there in the plans, on Drawing No. 3, bottom center of the page. It MUST be used with Bunji chords, in the event of a bunji chordfailure. When I had Bunji's, I set the length of this cable to allow the suggested 2 1/2" of travel, but it seemed I would bottom out the suspension onthis cable, even for just a moderately hard landing. It sent a hard BAM throughout the airframe. I could never get my bunji's tight enough, even aftershortening them up, and re-tying them 6 or 8 times...no easy chore to re-installthem. I think maybe 2 3/4" would be better, but tube inside would have to be longer if that safety cable were longer. Spring of '04, I finally gave up on the bunji's, after one of them came un-tied, and retrofitted with spring gear. It's not necessary with springs, because the slot the bolt rides in will only allow X amount of deflection. I like the springs MUCH better than the bunji's...relatively maintenance free (oilonce in a while), and I have Never bottomed them out.Chuck G.NX770CG________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2006 10:13:11 -0700

Original Posted By: "Dick Navratil"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Landing Gear strengthIn a message dated 4/16/2006 12:15:24 PM Central Standard Time, at7000ft(at)gmail.com writes:Arn't safety cables sometimes used with spring type split gear also? Just in case a weld or something breaks on a hard landing?Rick H.I've never seen them on spring gear, in fact I don't know how you would do it. As the gear takes on weight, the springs compress. Kind of strange lookingwhen you watch the gear actuate by rocking the plane back & forth. I've done some runway hardness tests, and the gear holds up just fine.Chuck G.Home Pietenpol NX770CG________________________________________________________________________________