Brodhead Pietenpol Association

Original Posted By: Dan Yocum
Ok guys I made my gussets on my horizontal stab too big! yes there is such a thing.Now my capstrip placement is off. If I place the capstrip where it belongsas evenly placed I go right over my capstrip. I have attached a picture.I am thinking about just moving the capstrip placement 1" to it's planned placement.What are your thoughts? Little embarrassed I didn't lay it all out,but I guess that is what learning is for!Thanks,BillN424BKRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_ ... ______Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 20:44:18 -0500

Original Posted By: "bcolleran"
Moving the capstrip 1 inch won't be a problem.Greg Cardinal----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By: Ben Charvet

Original Posted By: Rick Holland
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: horiz stab capstrip question

Original Posted By: Jim

Original Posted By: helspersew(at)aol.com
Can anyone with experience welding bronze (fairly thick) drop me an email off line.Its not for my Piet, but close. Thanks,Stevechase143(at)aol.com--------Stevewww.mypiet.comRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Off-topic welding question (Bronze)Date: Wed, 19 May 2010 10:46:57 -0400

Original Posted By: "Jerry Dotson"
Bill,It wouldn't be too hard to trim off the ends of the gussets with a small back saw,then shave back to the cut.TomOn May 18, 2010, at 9:20 PM, bcolleran wrote:> > Ok guys I made my gussets on my horizontal stab too big! yes there is such athing. Now my capstrip placement is off. If I place the capstrip where it belongsas evenly placed I go right over my capstrip. I have attached a picture.I am thinking about just moving the capstrip placement 1" to it's plannedplacement. What are your thoughts? Little embarrassed I didn't lay it all out,but I guess that is what learning is for!> > Thanks,> > Bill> N424BK> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 128#298128> > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0502_166.jpg> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans

Original Posted By: "GliderMike"
Welcome to the forum. You are in for a fun time. I am also building. My wing isalmost ready for varnish. Enjoy the build. You will have questions. They canbe answered here.--------Jerry Dotson59 Daniel Johnson RdBaker, FL 32531Started building NX510JD July, 2009Ribs and tailfeathers doneusing Lycoming O-235Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans

Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Thanks Jerry,I'm excited to get started. This list is part of what pushed me over the edgeto get started. Lots of good information here.--------Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,GliderMike, aka Mike GlasgowRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Thu, 20 May 2010 05:57:14 -0700 (PDT)

Original Posted By: Jim Markle

Original Posted By: "GliderMike"
Bill,Just a tip for future reference, as you progress with your project.The plans don't really provide many dimensions for gussets, but it may be helpfulto know that the "extra" gusset material really doesn't do anything for you,other than add weight. When determining the size of a gusset like the one pictured,there's no need to go past the edges of the pieces being joined. See thered lines in the attached picture for reference.But, like others have said, in this case, just shift your capstrip over to theedge of your gusset. If you're very careful, you COULD trim away the excess gusset,but there's a very real risk of cutting into the Spruce sticks, and THATwould be a bad idea.Bill C. (not you... a Different Bill C.)Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/guss ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans

Original Posted By: "chase143(at)aol.com"
Thanks to everyone. I would definitely like to come to Brodhead, but I'm not suremy finances can stand it this year. I have been doing A&P school for thelast year and a half, and my wife is getting a little anxious about supportingus both now I'm out of school. I do have a Hajjimobile to make the Hajj to variousMecca locations, so I'm not ruling it out this year, yet. I also fly ultralightgliders at The Point of the Mountain in Utah, which is known worldwideas a Mecca for hang glider and paraglider pilots, which is why the Hajjimobilehas its name. I've been lurking the list for several months now, and havefigured out that being Markle-esque is sometimes necessary when you are associatedwith Pitenpol folks. [Laughing] [Rolling Eyes]--------Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,GliderMike, aka Mike GlasgowRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans

Original Posted By: airlion
Mike,Welcome aboard, you are in for a great journey building a Piet. Brodhead is agood time and a great first hand education. If you can swing it; one trip thereand you will say "I can't afford not to go"!Enjoy the building!Steve--------Stevewww.mypiet.comRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Thu, 20 May 2010 09:30:04 -0700 (PDT)

Original Posted By: Jim Markle

Original Posted By: "GliderMike"
TWlrZSwNCg0KV2VsY29tZSB0byB0aGUgbGlzdOKApi50aGVyZSBhcmUgc2V2ZXJhbCBQaWV0cyBoZXJlIGluIFV0YWguIEkgd2lsbCBjb250YWN0IHlvdSBvZmYgbGlzdC4NCg0KQnJpYW4NCg0KU0xDLVVUDQoNCkRvIG5vdCBhcmNoaXZlDQoNCiANCg0K________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: horiz stab capstrip question

Original Posted By: "Jack Phillips"
Wouldn't it be better to go slightly wider than the red square, along the lineof edge distance with rivets? When I did Airframe stuff in school, my class gotscrewed out of the stick and rag stuff, so I don't know. Our instructor hada composites project he thought was more important, so we got zip on stick andrag. I think I was the only one in the class that had any interest in stickand rag. I'll get plenty building my Piet. I would agree Bill added extra weightthat doesn't get him anything but a couple of pounds of extra weight ifhe did that on the whole airframe. --------Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,GliderMike, aka Mike GlasgowRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Mike, I usually wait for Mike Cuy to say this to new Pietenpol builders, buthe's fallen down on the job so I'll say it:The best investment you can make when beginning to build a Piet is to buythe Tony Bongelis books, all four of them: The Sportplane Builder,Sportplane Construction Techniques, Firewall Forward, and Tony Bingelis onEngines. Other worthwhile investments are the EAA's book on AircraftWelding, Chet Peek's book on the Pietenpol, and Mike Cuy's video on buildingand flying a Pietenpol Air Camper. Chuck Gantzer also has a nice videoavailable. I know Michael Perez is offering DVD's on building hints, but Ihaven't seen them, nor have I seen his airplane. Most of the questions you will have are covered in one or more of thosesources. Anything else you can probably get answered on this forum in thearchives.Good luck, and "Go Thou, and make Sawdust"Jack PhillipsNX899JPRaleigh, NC-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: Michael Perez
TmljZSBqb2IgSmFjaywgaGUgd291bGQgaGF2ZSBiZWVuIHByb3VkDQoNCkRvIG5vdCBhcmNoaXZlDQoNClBNIERhbmdlcg0KU2VudCBmcm9tIG15IFZlcml6b24gV2lyZWxlc3MgQmxhY2tCZXJyeQ0KDQotLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KRnJvbTogIkphY2sgUGhpbGxpcHMiIDxwaWV0Zmx5ckBiZWxsc291dGgubmV0Pg0KRGF0ZTogRnJpLCAyMSBNYXkgMjAxMCAwNzowNzo0MyANClRvOiA8cGlldGVucG9sLWxpc3RAbWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbT4NClN1YmplY3Q6IFJFOiBQaWV0ZW5wb2wtTGlzdDogUmU6IHBsYW5zDQoNCk1pa2UsIEkgdXN1YWxseSB3YWl0IGZvciBNaWtlIEN1eSB0byBzYXkgdGhpcyB0byBuZXcgUGlldGVucG9sIGJ1aWxkZXJzLCBidXQNCmhlJ3MgZmFsbGVuIGRvd24gb24gdGhlIGpvYiBzbyBJJ2xsIHNheSBpdDoNCg0KVGhlIGJlc3QgaW52ZXN0bWVudCB5b3UgY2FuIG1ha2Ugd2hlbiBiZWdpbm5pbmcgdG8gYnVpbGQgYSBQaWV0IGlzIHRvIGJ1eQ0KdGhlIFRvbnkgQm9uZ2VsaXMgYm9va3MsIGFsbCBmb3VyIG9mIHRoZW06ICBUaGUgU3BvcnRwbGFuZSBCdWlsZGVyLA0KU3BvcnRwbGFuZSBDb25zdHJ1Y3Rpb24gVGVjaG5pcXVlcywgRmlyZXdhbGwgRm9yd2FyZCwgYW5kIFRvbnkgQmluZ2VsaXMgb24NCkVuZ2luZXMuICBPdGhlciB3b3J0aHdoaWxlIGludmVzdG1lbnRzIGFyZSB0aGUgRUFBJ3MgYm9vayBvbiBBaXJjcmFmdA0KV2VsZGluZywgQ2hldCBQZWVrJ3MgYm9vayBvbiB0aGUgUGlldGVucG9sLCBhbmQgTWlrZSBDdXkncyB2aWRlbyBvbiBidWlsZGluZw0KYW5kIGZseWluZyBhIFBpZXRlbnBvbCBBaXIgQ2FtcGVyLiAgQ2h1Y2sgR2FudHplciBhbHNvIGhhcyBhIG5pY2UgdmlkZW8NCmF2YWlsYWJsZS4gIEkga25vdyBNaWNoYWVsIFBlcmV6IGlzIG9mZmVyaW5nIERWRCdzIG9uIGJ1aWxkaW5nIGhpbnRzLCBidXQgSQ0KaGF2ZW4ndCBzZWVuIHRoZW0sIG5vciBoYXZlIEkgc2VlbiBoaXMgYWlycGxhbmUuICANCg0KTW9zdCBvZiB0aGUgcXVlc3Rpb25zIHlvdSB3aWxsIGhhdmUgYXJlIGNvdmVyZWQgaW4gb25lIG9yIG1vcmUgb2YgdGhvc2UNCnNvdXJjZXMuICBBbnl0aGluZyBlbHNlIHlvdSBjYW4gcHJvYmFibHkgZ2V0IGFuc3dlcmVkIG9uIHRoaXMgZm9ydW0gaW4gdGhlDQphcmNoaXZlcy4NCg0KR29vZCBsdWNrLCBhbmQgIkdvIFRob3UsIGFuZCBtYWtlIFNhd2R1c3QiDQoNCkphY2sgUGhpbGxpcHMNCk5YODk5SlANClJhbGVpZ2gsIE5DDQoNCi0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2FnZS0tLS0tDQpGcm9tOiBvd25lci1waWV0ZW5wb2wtbGlzdC1zZXJ2ZXJAbWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbQ0KW21haWx0bzpvd25lci1waWV0ZW5wb2wtbGlzdC1zZXJ2ZXJAbWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbV0gT24gQmVoYWxmIE9mDQpjaGFzZTE0MyhhdClhb2wuY29tDQpTZW50OiBUaHVyc2RheSwgTWF5IDIwLCAyMDEwIDEyOjI0IFBNDQpUbzogcGlldGVucG9sLWxpc3RAbWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbQ0KU3ViamVjdDogUGlldGVucG9sLUxpc3Q6IFJlOiBwbGFucw0KDQotLT4gUGlldGVucG9sLUxpc3QgbWVzc2FnZSBwb3N0ZWQgYnk6ICJjaGFzZTE0MyhhdClhb2wuY29tIg0KPGNoYXNlMTQzQGFvbC5jb20+DQoNCk1pa2UsDQpXZWxjb21lIGFib2FyZCwgeW91IGFyZSBpbiBmb3IgYSBncmVhdCBqb3VybmV5IGJ1aWxkaW5nIGEgUGlldC4gIEJyb2RoZWFkIGlzDQphIGdvb2QgdGltZSBhbmQgYSBncmVhdCBmaXJzdCBoYW5kIGVkdWNhdGlvbi4gSWYgeW91IGNhbiBzd2luZyBpdDsgb25lIHRyaXANCnRoZXJlIGFuZCB5b3Ugd2lsbCBzYXkgIkkgY2FuJ3QgYWZmb3JkIG5vdCB0byBnbyIhDQpFbmpveSB0aGUgYnVpbGRpbmchDQpTdGV2ZQ0KDQotLS0tLS0tLQ0KU3RldmUNCnd3dy5teXBpZXQuY29tDQoNCg0KDQoNClJlYWQgdGhpcyB0b3BpYyBvbmxpbmUgaGVyZToNCg0KaHR0cDovL2ZvcnVtcy5tYXRyb25pY3MuY29tL3ZpZXd0b3BpYy5waHA/cD0yOTgzMzIjMjk4MzMyDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg=________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 21 May 2010 06:36:42 -0700 (PDT)

Original Posted By: Rick Holland
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Ailerflappers> RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]" > Putting flapperons on a Pietenpol would be like putting whipped cream on an onion. > > Dan Y. is right, the stall speed of a Piet is already ridiculously low, the dragis exorbitantly high, > and the approach angle power-off without flaps is steep enough for you to tieyour shoes without> bending over. > > Mike C.> > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 21 May 2010 12:45:30 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: horiz stab capstrip question

Original Posted By: "Bill Church"
I'm just curious as to why? For what benefit or change in performance?I'm not saying it's a good or bad idea. I'm sure it could be done.Wayne Bressler Jr.Taildraggers, Inc.taildraggersinc.comOn May 21, 2010, at 10:08 AM, Jeff wilson wrote:> Has anyone tried flaperons? Is it feasable?> Jeff Wilson> 'niner whiskey tango'> N899WT>>________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: horiz stab capstrip question

Original Posted By: "GliderMike"
Lots of people have tried flaperons. Just not on a Pietenpol. :)By that, I don't mean that no-one has tried it on a Pietenpol, just not "lots ofpeople".The better question would be "Why would anyone need flaps on a Pietenpol?".The basic purpose of flaps is to lower the stall speed. Well, the Piet wing alreadyhas a very slow stall speed, so why bother adding unnecessary complicationsand weight, with debatable benefit.Flaperons make sense on some aircraft, but I don't think the Pietenpol is one ofthem.Bill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: horiz stab capstrip question

Original Posted By: "Bill Church"
Bill, looking at the photo with the red line, and the plans, I can see the redoutlined gusset is larger. Where I went to high school, 45 years ago, we didn'thave wood shop, and I've never had the privilege of being around a cabinetmaker or furniture maker, so I'm pretty green on wood working stuff. Lookingat the plans pic, there is more than enough coverage from the gussets to makethe joint strong. If it weren't strong enough, there would be Pietenpols fallingout of the sky, and that hasn't been happening. What little bit of weldingstuff I have done, I've used smaller gussets for reinforcing a corner than usedhere, with good success. I tend to overbuild things, because I've had problemswith things breaking because they were slightly under built. A major reasonI chose the Piet for my first airplane project if because there are a largenumber of successful builders who are willing to help with advice. I've wanteda stick and rag airplane for thirty years, and felt the least expensive wayto get one was to build it. With support from successful builders like you,I will be able to accomplish my goal. I hear "follow the plans," probably morethan any other advice on all of the chat groups. I know that is good advice,and should be strongly adhered to, but as one who tends to overbuild, it issometimes difficult to do. Sort of like the deal, "when you're up to your *#$*in alligators, it is difficult to remember, the initial objective is to drainthe swamp." The edge distance deal with rivets, is you don't want the metalripping out, because the rivet hole was too close to the edge. Same as youdon't drive a nail too close to the edge of a piece of wood. Thanks for yourpatience.--------Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,GliderMike, aka Mike GlasgowRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: horiz stab capstrip question

Original Posted By: "GliderMike"
No problem Mike.I didn't get to take wood shop in high school either. I always thought I got cheatedthere. I've had no formal training in woodworking either. I learned whatlittle I know about woodworking from watching my Dad (who DID get wood shop inhigh school - but that's all), and then trying things. If you're building thewood fuselage, just follow the plans. Many say that the Piet is overbuilt already- so resist ANY temptation to beef things up - all it will get you is aheavy plane.If you're building a steel tube fuselage, you'll be more on your own since theplans are "sparse". Lots of details to figure out on your own.Oh, and my point about mentioning "rivets" was that there aren't really any inthe Piet. (I know, the plans say to attach the tail cable fittings with rivets,but those don't count)This List is a great place to learn, with a nice bunch of people. Welcome to thegroup, and have fun building.Bill C.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans

Original Posted By: Dan Yocum
Videos ordered. Still shopping on books. Need to take more time to get latestedition of each.--------Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,GliderMike, aka Mike GlasgowRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________