Brodhead Pietenpol Association

Original Posted By: "tdudley(at)umn.edu"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Plans for a good fuse workbenchHi All:I am not remembering off hand where I saw a design for a solid freestanding workbench for the fuse, and eventually for the wing andstab/fin. I have a wall mounted, solid core door workbench made of 2solid core doors, butted together and attached to the wall. I want touse these as the top of the bench, and build a solid base to mountthese 36" x 96" doors to. I am thinking I saw some plans somewherethat drew out a bench that would be free standing and solid like this,and I can't find it in my stuff. Anyone have a link or a scan of thiskind of thing? I figure I can design my own, but I'd rather not as I'drather be thinking of building the fuse )Thanks for any advice!Mark________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: Mark Roberts
Yep, got mine from Vi at Brodhead for $70. They are nice. I agree that they wouldbe easy to make, but his are ready to mount... all I had to do was routerthe recess and drill mounting holes. --------Mark ChouinardWings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on FuselageRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2011 16:23:30 -0800Subject: Pietenpol-List: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: "tdudley(at)umn.edu"
Gary,I do want to make the metal fittings; I want to do everything I can on this project.After meeting with the guy this morning, I got the impression I'd be ableto build the parts myself with his assistance. That's the part that got meexcited.I'd guess that with a little early mentorship in the welding department, I'd gainthe skills needed to get most of the other parts done. I believe you whenyou say learning the skill is very rewarding.TomRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Tail Section Hinges

Original Posted By: "Scott Knowlton "
Mark,Maybe in direct contrast to my last post, what was the turn around time to getthe hinges? Does Vi supply all metal parts?TomRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: tdudley(at)umn.edu
Oh...and I purchased the VK hinges, despite what I just said! Happy building!Gary------Original Message------

Original Posted By: Mark Roberts
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Plans for a good fuse workbenchCheck the EAA plans for work benches. I built two five footers and another 4 footer.They are great sturdy all purpose benches with easy to follow plans. Scott Knowlton-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: "K5YAC"
Mark,There is a good description of building a solid workbench in the January, 2010issue of EAA SportAviation. You can download a copy from the archives. I usedit to build my tables. (I'd link it, but I'm not computer saavy enough.)TomRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Tail Section Hinges

Original Posted By: "tdudley(at)umn.edu"
In my experience, turn around was quick... as quick I could count out three 20sand a 10, we shook hands and I told him Thanks! He had the hinges for sale atBrodhead. Give him a call.... maybe he has a set or two ready to ship.--------Mark ChouinardWings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on FuselageRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Tail Section Hinges

Original Posted By: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
Mark,I should have realized that before I posted--I did read you got it from him atBrodhead.TomRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Tail Section Hinges

Original Posted By: "tdudley(at)umn.edu"
Mark,Here's a link: http://www.oshkosh365.org/ok365_Discuss ... =3592Plans are about half way down the page.Wayne BresslerTaildraggers, Inc.www.taildraggersinc.comOn Feb 9, 2011, at 7:23 PM, Mark Roberts wrote:> > Hi All:> > I am not remembering off hand where I saw a design for a solid free> standing workbench for the fuse, and eventually for the wing and> stab/fin. I have a wall mounted, solid core door workbench made of 2> solid core doors, butted together and attached to the wall. I want to> use these as the top of the bench, and build a solid base to mount> these 36" x 96" doors to. I am thinking I saw some plans somewhere> that drew out a bench that would be free standing and solid like this,> and I can't find it in my stuff. Anyone have a link or a scan of this> kind of thing? I figure I can design my own, but I'd rather not as I'd> rather be thinking of building the fuse )> > Thanks for any advice!> > Mark> > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Tail Section Hinges

Original Posted By: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
So Gary, you're saying it wouldn't be too much a compromise to buy the hinges? Glad to hear it. I just got off the phone with Mr. Kapler. He said he couldsend them to me this week. (I'll build the other metal parts!) Kind of interesting--Vi said he bought one of his Piets from Ed Sampson in Bellview,MN. I spoke with Ed on the phone a few weeks ago and he said I could drivedown to visit with him and talk building. Ed apparently built the Piet fuseat the EAA museum. Lots of Piet knowledge within easy driving distance.TomRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Tail Section Hinges

Original Posted By: tdudley(at)umn.edu
You're in good hands! See you at Brodhead?Gary------Original Message------

Original Posted By: "Jack"
Here's the workbench I designed. It's 3-3'X5' tables bolted together. Long enougha long fuse. You only need 2-4x8' sheets of plywood and 10-8'-2x4's.Curt MerdanFlower Mound, TXRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/15_w ... __________

Original Posted By: "Chris"
I don't have any written plans for my workbenches, I just built them to a comfortableheight (in my case about 42") and matched the dimentions to 4' x 8' x 5/8"cabinet grade birch plywood. I used standard grade 1/2" plywood for the lowershelf. I also bored 1" holes in the bottom of the legs to accept some 1"aluminum round stock that I drilled and tapped to accept 3/8" x 16 bolts. Itacked some heavy flat washers to the heads of 2" long 3/8" x 16 bolts and usedthem as leveling feet, which worked out good, especially when I wanted to levelup for my fuselage work. Once I started applying spar varnish to my wingribs, I went ahead and applied a couple of coats to my workbench tops. I highlyrecommend doing that... it looks nicer and is more durable.These were the first things I built for the Pietenpol adventure. They can be used separately, which is how I will normally keep them... (wow, thatseems like a long time ago). Or they can be lined up end to end (16' long) and leveled up for a fuselage jig.I guess it depends on what you have room for.--------Mark ChouinardWings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on FuselageRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
I built my bench out of doors and 2x4s. Nothing fancy but worked great. Youwill be a bit short in length but planed correctly and it works fine.http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%2 ... Sacramento, CaWestcoastpiet.com-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: V Groah
a good fuse workbenchWow guys! Many thanks for all the info...I had to let my EAA national membership lapse due to the financialcrisis of the last year and 2 months, but I plan to renew soon and Ican access the plans they have on the EAA download site.Seems simple enough to just build a table, but I thought I'd ask y'allbecause of the 'Round shoulders, flat forehead" syndrome I sufferfrom. It's the result of the moment when you shrug your shoulders, andslap your forehead once you see something and say "Why didn't I thinkof that BEFORE I built my table!"I have so much room in the barn that I am considering one long tableversus separate ones, but that may change when I actually start theproject. I had been planning the ribs and wing first due to space, butI might start the fuse (more desirable) and then I have the mountingpoint for all the rest. Besides, you just can't sit on a wing and makeairplane noises as well as you can a fuse.Oh, one other really cool thing: I am drawing the metal parts up inSketch Up and cleaning them in my CAD program so I can deliver them toan old acquaintance I have recently renewed a relationship with. Heowns a steel fabrication company, and has a laser cutting machine forhis fabrication plant. He said "How thick are the parts? NO problem!Bring me the pans and I'll cut all those parts for you to perfection!"Yes Gary Boothe, I know it's cheating. And yes, I know how long ittook you to make your parts. But I am relieved! :oDThanks again for all the advice. I hope to post some pics in the next few weeks.Any suggestions on programs to use for the build log online?MarkOn Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 5:52 AM, K5YAC wrote:>> Yes, I am tall.... I might be able to look OVER the wing.>> I also can't spell dimensions. [Embarassed]>> --------> Mark Chouinard> Wings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on Fuselage>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: "kevinpurtee"
Additionally, and the experts can correct me, my sense is that the leading edgeplywood provides significant stiffness to the structure. Don't think I'd considerbuilding the wing without said plywood.--------Kevin "Axel" PurteeNX899KPAustin/Georgetown, TXRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: "kevinpurtee"
Mark's tall. I built mine to 36" & cut them down to 32" when I had the chance(4'X16').Kevin--------Kevin "Axel" PurteeNX899KPAustin/Georgetown, TXRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Tail Section Hinges

Original Posted By: Mark Roberts
Precious PeteBasic Pietenpol85 HP ContinentalEnlarged, extended 2-piece wingSteel tube fuselageRoomy cockpitsMetal propFlies great!Contact Roger White 918-698-3771.--------Mark ChouinardWings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on FuselageRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 07:57:02 -0800Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
I made mine from old closet doors and 2x4's and welder's jack stands. It lookscrude and is I guess but very temporary. All the doors will go back in overheadstorage when the build is done. The jack stands make for a very rigid tableand precise leveling. It is 3' X 32' for the 1 piece wing.--------Jerry Dotson59 Daniel Johnson RdBaker, FL 32531Started building NX510JD July, 2009wing, tailfeathers done, fuselage rollingusing Lycoming O-235Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: Mark Roberts
Mark,If you know a guy who'll laser cut your parts, go for it! But here's what I have learned about rib building: If you build the ribs first,you can be done in 30 days; if you get distracted by other parts, it could take3 years! Pretty soon you get a nasty-gram from Kevin or Ryan, more or lesssaying, "Good God, Man! Just finish the ribs, already!"Gary Boothe3 to go...Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By:> mark.rbrts1(at)gmail.com
Mark.Good to see you back. If you are serious about starting a Piet you might want to consider coming 40 miles south and look at ours before we blow it apart for fabric. We are just about ready to do that. In about 6 weeks it will be in pieces again for fabric. We have photos of some of the jigs we made that worked and could give some guidance on things that could be done wrong. Yes=2C we did have a couple of things that after close examination had to be redone. It Happens. Bring a camera and take photos. It is not like we have the ideal plane or know all the answers. We don't. We have=2C however=2C gone through the process and have a result. We found that grabbing ideas from other builders that had gone before us saved a lot of head scratching and avoided a lot of missteps. Besides=2C we would like to see you again. Come and see us=2C we are not far away. Vic and Mike Groah.Ps. Any other Piet guys are welcome too. Just contact us. vgroah@hotmail.com > Date: Thu=2C 10 Feb 2011 07:57:02 -0800> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Vic,How about posting a few pics of your plane before you "blow it apart"for covering. Thanks.BrianSLC-UT

Original Posted By: Michael Groah

Original Posted By:> hangar10(at)cox.net
Correct good idea. Vic > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Micheal,Look at Westcoastpiet under Dennis Hall. I took those pictures myself at Brodhead. I basically used his set-up for inspiration for mine. A picture is worth......you know.Dan HelsperPoplar Grove, IL.-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: John Kuhfahl
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Band Type Brake Cable

Original Posted By: Michael Perez

Original Posted By: "Piet2112"
Vic,I take it you and your son are in Fresno???--------Perry ShipmanLakeside, CARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: Mark Roberts
I noticed there is a theme starting to happen. I don't know if Kevin had anythingto do with it. But why does everyone have an axel in their workshop? Motivation?If so, I'm going to get one. Does size matter?Curt MerdanFlower Mound, TXRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/piet ... ______Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 19:13:47 -0800Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: Mark Roberts
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: "Clif Dawson"
Perry,My dad and I are in Tulare Ca (about 45 miles south of Fresno). Mike GroahSent from my iPhoneOn Feb 10, 2011, at 6:08 PM, "PShipman" wrote:> > Vic,> > I take it you and your son are in Fresno???> > --------> Perry Shipman> Lakeside, CA> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 538#330538> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: "Billy McCaskill"
Why not just put the plan set in sketchup as is and hit themagnification key? That way the whole damn thing will bein proportion only bigger.Right? Am I right or what!Clif "The man who has no imagination has no wings." ~ Muhammad Ali > > At 6'4" and almost as big around, I am needing the extra width to the> fuse (28" wide at the back seat) and I am lengthening the nose a bit> (Per Bernard's suggestion due to a lighter motor), AND I am using the> GA-30-613.5 airfoil. One last thing is the extra bay's I am adding to> the wing tips and deepening the spars (keeping them at 1" thick,> carefully routed for lightness) and moving the strut connection points> out one bay to support the extra bays, and I felt I needed to insure> the changes all fit when I hit the shop.> > I know that sounds like lots of changes, but the design elements all> take the same Piet form, and I am building an airplane that will be> mine until I decide I don't want it anymore, or can't fly, so I felt> I'd build it to fit ME, not Bernard ) I am really gonna build> me a plane!> > Mark________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Band Type Brake Cable

Original Posted By: "Jerry Dotson"
Whatever type of brake cables you end up using, be sure to lube them with grease,and NOT oil... the oil will run out/ evaporate over time (less time thanyou think) and make the cables stick and bind. I lube the clutch and throttlecables on my motorcycle with lithium grease once a year, and never have problemswith them. You can get a small cable lubing device from most any motorcycleshop that clamps around the cable and allows you to use a spray lube in a canwith the little red straw to directly inject the lube down into the sheath. Just lube until you see the grease coming out the other end and your cablewill be happy for quite some time.--------Billy McCaskillUrbana, ILtail section almost done, starting on ribs soonRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Band Type Brake Cable

Original Posted By: airlion
I bought bicycles cable at Walmart for about $5 for my mechanical disc brakes.They are plenty strong for my installation. I tried to break an old cable andcouldn't so that is good enough for me. No lube. I will replace as necessary $5and 5 minutes. It should get wet many times as it will be inside a hangar whennot flying.--------Jerry Dotson59 Daniel Johnson RdBaker, FL 32531Started building NX510JD July, 2009wing, tailfeathers done, fuselage rollingusing Lycoming O-235Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 05:19:34 -0800 (PST)

Original Posted By: Mark Roberts
I'm a little concerned about some of the comments I've heard recently about pilotheight, for example, in the Workbench thread...airlion(at)bellsouth.net wrote:> Mark, you might consider adding 10 inches to the verticle stab as Pat Green didin florida after getting into a spin and finally recovering at 500 ft. I understandthat the pilot was real tall and blocked out the flow to the tail. > Good luck, Gardiner MasonI have been doing my best at keeping with the plans so far. I did raise the heightof my turtle deck a bit, but just barely more than my shoulders would normallyblock, and this was only done for proper seatbelt placement. Are any ofyou taller pilots experiencing ill effects? Given that I am 6'4" tall, are therethings I should consider in making my airplane more safe or stable? Basically,do I need more rudder? Jack P., I know that you are pretty tall... care to comment in the rudder effectivenessand what might (or should) be done to improve it?--------Mark ChouinardWings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on FuselageRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 09:33:41 -0800Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: Mark Roberts
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: Charles Waldo
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: Mark Roberts
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Original Posted By: "gtche98"
Gary, Check out Barnstormers, West Virginia. My auto pilot Ed has a lot for salejust across the runway from our place, the big red roof on the left side ofthe near end of the runway. It needs some dirt work and the oil tank removed,but the neighbors are great. ;<)SkipPS. Lots of sewing machines on the field.----- Original Message ----- So, with all this talk of Hanger Houses, at lunch, I just had to ask my wife of20+ years, How would you feel about living in a hanger with living quarters?.Fine with me as long as I have room for a computer and a sewing machine. I haveno idea where one finds such airports, though! Certainly not here in California!Gary Boothe________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Looks like beautiful country! We have great weather, here, but those kindsof places just don't exist.Gary

Original Posted By: "Gboothe5"
Good job on the models guys. In the process of trying to teach myself how to usesketch-up (I have zero CAD experience), I tried to draw just a single rib.Two hours later, I gave up with little more than the airfoil profile to showfor it.I wish that you could buy a sketch-up model of the plane with the plans. it wouldbe nice to be able to spin a model around in 3 dimensions to figure out howsome things go together. Maybe one of you that are more talented than I shouldoffer to sell the rights to one of your models. --------Gary WilsonGreenville Wisconsingtche98 (at) gmail ((dot)) comPlanning PhaseRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Where do you guys find this scatsup, or sketchup or whatever you call it?Seems that you are spending an inordinate amount of time on it that could bespent making sawdust. Of course, it may be critical to determining yourpaint scheme.Jack PhillipsNX899JP "Icarus Plummet"Raleigh, NC-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: airlion

Original Posted By: Charles Waldo
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Mark,Flamed, Yes. Banned, I don't think so...Most of what you propose has already been done, to some extent. 4' centersections, enlarged tail surfaces, deeper fuselage, taller panel andturtledeck, tipped back pilot seat, etc. The only new idea I see is theplastic drag 'wires'...interesting idea! I say, "Experiment away...!" Andlet He Who Says He Built To Plans speak up, 'cause I have yet to see anyonewith a ternplate fuel tank...Gary-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: "Gboothe5"
Incidentally, what is 'ternplate'?----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By: "Charles Campbell"
Sheet steel coated with a mixture or tin and lead/zinc. Commonly used in the construction of fuel tanks many years ago.Greg Cardinal----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By:> ----- Original Message ----- "Charles Campbell"
I think the correct term is ternplate ??Kip GardnerOn Feb 12, 2011, at 6:18 PM, Greg Cardinal wrote:> > Sheet steel coated with a mixture or tin and lead/zinc. Commonly used in theconstruction of fuel tanks many years ago.> > Greg Cardinal>

Original Posted By: Ryan Mueller
Jack,I am using a Scott 2000 with a 4 leaf Citabria 7ac spring, 3 and a helper spring.They are good tailwheels but forgetabout any new parts for them.Have it bolted on with an AN6 and a bracket at therear.Dave--------Covering PietRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/2011 ... ______Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2011 18:23:33 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Plans for a good fuse workbench