Brodhead Pietenpol Association

Original Posted By: Greg Bacon
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Strut fittings

Original Posted By: Greg Bacon
Hi Greg,Thank you for the kind words. I have attached a pic of the fitting. This is a J-3 fork. If you can get a drawing of that fork you will be able to eye-ball how much thread engagement I have there. Yes I used the small struts from Carlson. This set-up is working well so far. If I can be of further service let me know.Dan H-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: Jim Markle

Original Posted By: "AircamperN11MS"
I have fixed struts on the front and adjustable on the rear to set washout. Itis a pretty standard way of building lift struts.--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum Strut fittings

Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Use your front struts to set your dihedral if you have any and rears for washout.You can also correct a heavy wing issue with the rear strut adjustment. Ihave a three piece wing and have dihedral.--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2012 11:02:03 -0700 (PDT)

Original Posted By: Jim Markle
Jim,If you are careful maybe you can get away with it. A laser level would be very helpful. Then you could be sure of what you are doing.Dan HelsperPuryear, TN-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: Ken Bickers
Curt,I live in Alexandria which is about an hour away. I am building a Piet as my firstproject so I don't know if that qualifies me for what you have in mind, butI can offer my help.TomRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Sat, 18 Aug 2012 06:57:10 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Strut fittings

Original Posted By: "Ken Bickers"
Or use a "bunyip" aka water level. Buy a length of clear plastic tubing at the hardware store, fill it with water (almost), find a helper, hold it up to the wing, then observe the level of the water on each end of the tube to find level or whatever amount of dihedral you want. Larry----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By: "Billy McCaskill"
Orrin, I meant to share this with you a few weeks ago, but I'm just now gettingaround to it. Here is a picture of some of your family when they visited myhangar last winter. You probably already know, but for the sake of other readers,they are (L to R)... Bernice Hoopman (Finke) - daughter of Orrin C., JohnFinke - son of Don, Cathy Ryan - daughter of Bernice and John and Orrin's granddaughter,and the blonde girl in the back is Angie Hyatt - daughter of KathyRyan and Orrin's great granddaughter. She is surrounded by her family... I'msorry, I forget their names. Kathy and Angie live here in Oklahoma while Berniceand John still live in Cherry Grove.Hope you enjoy the photo!--------Mark ChouinardWings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing GearRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/hoop ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum Strut fittings

Original Posted By: "Chris"
A bunyip will only be useful for setting dihedral if your shop/hangar floor isdead-flat and level. If the floor has even a slight pitch or slant to it, youcould end up with some weird rigging issues. Your fuselage could be sittingat the same angle as the floor, but your wingtips will be level with each other.The stretched string is probably better suited for this job.--------Billy McCaskillBaker, LAtail section almost done, starting on ribs soonRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Gary's plane looks fantastic and he is very popular at the airport with lotsof visitors and people waving as he taxies by. I can also report that theCorvair engine preformed admirably as a ground based vehicle power plant,but I would expect that from a car engine.ChrisSacramento, CaWestcoastpiet.com _____

Original Posted By: shad bell

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Ken, Billy and others please further explain the string and stick method.I'm having trouble visualizing.Thanks!Jack TextorDSMNX1929T-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By:> owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Don't do any high speed taxis!!!!!!!On Aug 19, 2012, at 7:16 PM, "Gary Boothe" wrote:> > Sorry, Dan...couldn't resist...> > The last static test done, with the Dan Helsper Industrial Fish Scales,> showed a pull of 300#'s. Haven't done any high speed yet taxi's yet...> > Gary Boothe> NX308MB> > > -----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: Jack
A few years ago I was fortunate to be able to afford one of those fancy rotating laser levels. It even has a hand-held receiver (arrows and beeper) so that it can be used in bright sun. I have used this thing innumerable times on many different projects, including of course the Piet rigging. It really made it a no-brainer. Dan HelsperPuryear, TN-----Original Message-----

Original Posted By: Jim Markle
Wish I could make it, but I don't think it would be a good choice to skip my wedding for it, might inhibit later outings!! However, if anyone want to do a flyover at WACO airport in Troy between 1530 and 1700, that would be pretty cool :)Sent from my iPhoneOn Aug 20, 2012, at 2:42 AM, shad bell wrote:> Is anyone planning on flying their Piet to MERFI next saturday? The MERFI fly-in is at Urbana Grimes Airport in Urbana Ohio on Aug 25, 26. I plan on flying over on Saturday mid to late morning with my neighbors, a Cessna 140, a Space Walker2, and a Stits Playmate. If any of you Ohio Pieter's want to join us (Mike Cuy, Don Emch) We will be leaving Chapman Memorial on Saturday about 10-11 am. Hope to see some of you there.> > Shad> > ============================================================================================================================================> ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2012 07:41:22 -0500 (GMT-05:00)

Original Posted By: Michael Perez

Original Posted By: "Billy McCaskill"
Yes, you do have to level the fuselage first, forgot to mention that. Wouldn't you also have to level the fuselage with the stretched string method? Larry----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By: Michael Perez

Original Posted By: Greg Bacon
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum Strut fittings

Original Posted By: Greg Bacon
I've never used the string method, only a bunyip. Maybe Billy McCaskill can explain the string method further? Larry ----- Original Message -----

Original Posted By: Ken Bickers
I do a lot of machine tool rebuilding which is completely analogous to rigginga wing. I've noticed a couple of things which weren't completely explained.First, using a string to establish dihedral, or make sure there isn't any. It'salright to stretch a string between the wingtips and make sure it's 1 1/2" abovethe center section to establish dihedral, but you ALSO have to make surethat string is level, to make sure EACH SIDE has the same dihedral. Making sure a string is level isn't an easy thing with a level. Even a 4' levelisn't that long compared to 29', and holding it is another matter. Lastly,the quality of the typical 4' level isn't that great. Small errors transposedover 29' quickly add up. The laser level or water level will work better. Easilyas accurate, is to forget about level, and only worry about relative dimensions.Stretch a string near the floor under the front spar and get it as close to levelas you can by eye for convenience. Put another under the middle of the fuse,front to back, perpendicular to the first. Make sure it's perpendicular byusing a 3x4x5 pythagorean triplet. That is measure along one line 3', the other4' and make sure those two poings (which form the hypotenuse of a right triangle)are exactly 5' apart (diagonally). If they are, you have a REALLY accurateright angle. Adjust one string as necessary to make that happen.Prop up the plane's tail to get the top longeron of the fuse parallel to the frontto back string. If your fuse isn't covered, set a straight board across,hang a string down in the middle of it and make sure the middle is lined up andthe distance from that board to the string is the same, all along the centerlineof the fuse.Now make sure your fuselage is perpendicular to spar string in the x axis the sameway as described as making sure the wing is perpendicular to the fuse as lookedat from above. Now make sure the fuse is perpendicular to the spar string in the y axis. Clampa nice straight board to the side of the fuse down to the string. Make sureit makes a right angle. Measure up along that board 4', measure out along thestring 3' and then make sure the hypotenuse is 5'. Now just measure up from the spar string to points on the wing, using a plumb bob,to establish dihedral and make sure the wing is on straight (or the frontspar is).Now, put another string parallel to the front spar string, under the rear spar.Make sure it's parallel by just getting on the ground in front and make sureit lines up. If it lines up really close over 30', it'll be CLOSE. Gettingthe two spar strings to intersect the centerline string is where you need to bethe most finicky as you only have a few feet between them. Nice small string,with a fair amount of tension and be very finicky about them JUST touching.Now you measure up from the rear string to the spar just as the front. If youhave no washout, the dimensions will be the same. Or you can use direct measurementsto establish washout. Using this method will eliminate any error in reading level and error in your hangar'sfloor. I'm sure this might not be enough detail for some folks, but is detailed enoughspawn questions. Lastly, I've become pretty good friends with the guy at the EAA's museum who placedEVERY airplane in there. He's traveled ALL OVER the nation to get thoseplanes, taking them apart, hauling them back and putting them back together. His stories of just how INACCURATE the rigging is on so many of those airplanesis surprising. The point being, especially in the genre of a Piet, there'sa lot of forgiveness. However, if you're like me, it's just tough to sleep atnight worring about these things. Establishing a REALLY accurate datum shouldhelp a lot.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2012 08:55:27 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum Strut fittings

Original Posted By: catdesigns(at)att.net
Chris=2C how is yours coming? We have not seen or heard anything of you for a long time. The word is that family things are getting in the way=2C as well they should. Keep up some work and keep in touch. We need a couple more of those continental powered piets to harass with our corviars. Vic NX414MV And yes Gary's plane looks great!

Original Posted By: Greg Bacon
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum Strut fittings

Original Posted By: Ken Bickers
Ken explained it as well or better than I could. The taught string referencesonly the wing itself, and nothing else. Presuming that your cabanes/center sectionwere rigged square and plumb with the fuselage, it doesn't matter if yourfloor has any slope or pitch when establishing the dihedral (or lack thereof).As Ken said, you are measuring from the string stretched between the wingtipsto various points along the wing to make sure that your wingtips are eachat the same angle with respect to the center section. Adjust the length of yourlift struts to accommodate the dihedral angle you are trying to set. Clear as mud, right? Hope that this helps.--------Billy McCaskillBaker, LAtail section almost done, starting on ribs soonRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2012 09:35:53 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aluminum Strut fittings

Original Posted By: "Mark Roberts"
Back to the string method, if I understand the question correctly (Jack-?), howto use a string to set the dihedral. What I did was to stretch a string fromwingtip to wingtip more or less over the front spar, then measure the gap atthe centersection (see sketch). If I remember correctly, the gap is about 3".If you stand back and look at it, with the airplane set level (tail up), youcan tell if the wings are cranked up unevenly. Then if you move the string backto where it's over the aft spar, you can do the same thing for the aft struts.It worked when I rerigged Scout after pulling off the wings, but then again nothingwas moved very much from when it was originally rigged, so there wasn't alot of adjustment to be made.--------Oscar ZunigaMedford/Ashland, ORAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"A75 powerRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/stri ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Slow speed rush to 1st flight

Original Posted By: gboothe5(at)comcast.net
So is it mandatory that the pilot be color matched with his plane?"Here we see pilot and builder Gary Boothe posing in a wonderful Olive shirt sleevenext to his latest masterpiece, the Olive Poplar Piet..."Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Slow speed rush to 1st flight

Original Posted By: Mark Roberts
In a word, "Yes." But, then, you know how fashion conscious we are in Cali. ------Original Message------

Original Posted By: "Mark Roberts"
Hello Mark,The pedals are "homebuilder" pedals (single place version) from Aircraft Spruce:http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/l ... kit.phpThe brake cylinders are from MATCO (2361 South 1560 West, Woods Cross, UT 84087(801) 335-0582) http://www.matcomfg.com/contact.html...and were specialy made slightly shorter than the stock version. (I placed anorder with them on a weekday morning and the cylinders were on my doorstep THENEXT DAY...!)I am VERY happy with how they are fitting/integrating into my plane but have NOTfinished building it so "imitator" beware... :=)--------Jake Schultz - curator,Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/fron ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Control sticks in position...

Original Posted By: airlion
PERFECT!! Many thanks for the info. I think I might be getting closer to what Iwill be duplicating... Again, thanks for all the info!MarkRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2012 17:47:30 -0700 (PDT)

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
Gary's plane looks fantastic and he is very popular at the airport with lots of visitors and people waving as he taxies by. I can also report that the Corvair engine preformed admirably as a ground based vehicle power plant=2C but I would expect that from a car engine.ChrisSacramento=2C CaWestcoastpiet.com