Brodhead Pietenpol Association

Original Posted By: Johnkuhfahl
One way of securing the front of the horizontal stabilizer to the upper longerons.[cid:image001.jpg(at)01CFBBAC.1D3EFCF0] [cid:image002.jpg(at)01CFBBAC.1D3EFCF0]________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: "Charles N. Campbell"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: horizontal stabilizer and fuselage

Original Posted By: Steven Dortch
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: horizontal stabilizer and fuselage

Original Posted By: Ray Krause
Thanks, Charles. I just did this the other day to attach my Horizontal stabilizer. But I have an allied question. I see that many folks put their planes completely together during the rigging process, which I am doing. The question is : how do you allow for thickness change during covering? For example, the brackets holding the vertical stabilizer to the horizontal stabilizer...if you drill the brackets AND the holes in the vertical stabilizer, the holes will not match up after the vertical stabilizer is covered, right? There will be two thicknesses of fabric on the bottom of the stab, plus a tape. Or do you just allow enough space between the two stabs when drilling the holes and keep the stabs separated, or drill these holes after covering? There are other locations where this occurs.Could not find a way to search for this in the forum!Thanks,Ray KrauseBuilding SkyScoutSent from my iPad> On Aug 19, 2014, at 10:36 AM, "Charles N. Campbell" wrote:> > Michael, That is exactly how I'm attaching the stabilizer to the fuselage, but I still don't know how much of a shim I need to put between the two. Chuck> > >> On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 12:50 PM, Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC] wrote:>> One way of securing the front of the horizontal stabilizer to the upper longerons. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > ________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: Ken Bickers
Are the stabilizers rib stitched? Any degree numbers for up/down of the elevators, and side movement of the rudders?Did not try to search this out in the archives, but I will if no one responds!Thanks,Ray KrauseSent from my iPad> On Aug 19, 2014, at 11:29 AM, Steven Dortch wrote:> > I will measure the shim for my plane when I get home.> > Steve D> >> On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 12:36 PM, Charles N. Campbell wrote:>> Michael, That is exactly how I'm attaching the stabilizer to the fuselage, but I still don't know how much of a shim I need to put between the two. Chuck>> >> >>> On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 12:50 PM, Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC] wrote:>>> One way of securing the front of the horizontal stabilizer to the upper longerons. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > > > > -- > Blue Skies,> Steve D________________________________________________________________________________Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2014 21:53:19 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: horizontal stabilizer and fuselage

Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Ray,+/- 25=81=B0 will work on the elevators. Rudder should travel up to, but not interfere with, the elevators.Gary BootheNX308MB

Original Posted By:> owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-li
Thanks, Gary. Twenty- five is what I think I have on the Sonex, wonder if this is a standard number? I will go with as much rudder as I can get. Been flying the Aeronca the last few days with 90 degree cross winds, can never have enough rudder!You saved me again,RaySent from my iPad> On Aug 19, 2014, at 9:03 PM, "Gary Boothe" wrote:> > Ray,> > +/- 25=81=B0 will work on the elevators. Rudder should travel up to, but not interfere with, the elevators.> > Gary Boothe> NX308MB>

Original Posted By: Jack
Just spotted this for sale. Not Piet but still very nice.http://www.afors.com/index.php?page=adv ... ___Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: horizontal stabilizer and fuselage

Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Ray I used double sided carpet tape that equalled my covering process. We will see if it works...Sent from my iPadJack Textor> On Aug 19, 2014, at 10:43 PM, Ray Krause wrote:> > Thanks, Charles. I just did this the other day to attach my Horizontal stabilizer. But I have an allied question. I see that many folks put their planes completely together during the rigging process, which I am doing. The question is : how do you allow for thickness change during covering? For example, the brackets holding the vertical stabilizer to the horizontal stabilizer...if you drill the brackets AND the holes in the vertical stabilizer, the holes will not match up after the vertical stabilizer is covered, right? There will be two thicknesses of fabric on the bottom of the stab, plus a tape. Or do you just allow enough space between the two stabs when drilling the holes and keep the stabs separated, or drill these holes after covering? There are other locations where this occurs.> > Could not find a way to search for this in the forum!> > Thanks,> > Ray Krause> Building SkyScout> > > > Sent from my iPad> >> On Aug 19, 2014, at 10:36 AM, "Charles N. Campbell" wrote:>> >> Michael, That is exactly how I'm attaching the stabilizer to the fuselage, but I still don't know how much of a shim I need to put between the two. Chuck>> >> >>> On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 12:50 PM, Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC] wrote:>>> One way of securing the front of the horizontal stabilizer to the upper longerons. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D> ________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2014 03:42:00 -0700

Original Posted By: John Franklin

Original Posted By: "Douwe Blumberg"
Ray,Yes, you do rib stitch all the tail surfaces.--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: "jarheadpilot82"
Jack,And if the tape proves to be a little too thick, I guess you could add some to the bottom of the covered stab to make the holes line up. Great idea, I think I will do this.Thanks,Ray KrauseSent from my iPad> On Aug 20, 2014, at 3:14 AM, Jack wrote:> > Ray I used double sided carpet tape that equalled my covering process. We will see if it works...> > Sent from my iPad> Jack Textor> >> On Aug 19, 2014, at 10:43 PM, Ray Krause wrote:>> >> Thanks, Charles. I just did this the other day to attach my Horizontal stabilizer. But I have an allied question. I see that many folks put their planes completely together during the rigging process, which I am doing. The question is : how do you allow for thickness change during covering? For example, the brackets holding the vertical stabilizer to the horizontal stabilizer...if you drill the brackets AND the holes in the vertical stabilizer, the holes will not match up after the vertical stabilizer is covered, right? There will be two thicknesses of fabric on the bottom of the stab, plus a tape. Or do you just allow enough space between the two stabs when drilling the holes and keep the stabs separated, or drill these holes after covering? There are other locations where this occurs.>> >> Could not find a way to search for this in the forum!>> >> Thanks,>> >> Ray Krause>> Building SkyScout>> >> >> >> Sent from my iPad>> >>> On Aug 19, 2014, at 10:36 AM, "Charles N. Campbell" wrote:>>> >>> Michael, That is exactly how I'm attaching the stabilizer to the fuselage, but I still don't know how much of a shim I need to put between the two. Chuck>>> >>> >>>> On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 12:50 PM, Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC] wrote:>>>> One way of securing the front of the horizontal stabilizer to the upper longerons. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >> >> >> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D>> npol-List"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D>> //forums.matronics.com>> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D>> ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution>> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D>> > > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D> ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: horizontal stabilizer and fuselage

Original Posted By: Gerry Holland
Terry,Where do you find this stuff? It is amazing what you come up with! Thanks. Veryinteresting reading. Can you imagine building an "experimental" plane undersuch regulation?Thanks,Ray KrauseSent from my iPad> On Aug 20, 2014, at 6:59 PM, "jarheadpilot82" wrote:> > > Ray,> > This comes from the U.K. Pietenpol Type Acceptance Data Sheets. I have attacheda link to the entire paper, but the applicable part is pasted below.> > http://www.lightaircraftassociation.co. ... CAMPER.pdf> > --------> Semper Fi,> > Terry Hand> Athens, GA> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 928#428928> > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/image_133.jpg> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: horizontal stabilizer and fuselage

Original Posted By: "Clif Dawson"
Ray Hi! from England.Can you imagine building an "experimental" plane under such regulation?It's not as bad as it first seems.The LAA is between a rock and a hard place as they manage homebuilding effectively on behalf of our CAA (Civil Aviation Authority).Authority being the operative word! Get it wrong and the penalties are high.As you know there are quite a reasonable number of Piets here in UK and many with all types of personalisation passed by the LAA.During a 'scratch' or 'kit' build we can expect as many as 30 progress inspections from a local or nominated Inspector.These would also include Workshop conditions initially too.All in all it works albeit we all moan about delays in sign off etc.We end up with in most cases a well built homebuilt and a good safety record generally.It also means servicing your own aircraft against a regime of Inspection (by LAA Inspector) and Flight Test annually.I personally envy your system until sign off is required which seems from here a bit tough.The 40 hours fly off you have to do also seems high with ours being 5+ hours to gain initial Permit to Fly.Can be longer with new types.Thanks for feeling sorry for us! Donations gratefully received!G________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: jim hyde
Here's mine. The same only different.I'm pretty sure it would not be a good idea to let Godfly your plane. After all, He is immortal and can't behurt. It won't matter to Him if he were to crash. Hemight even see it as an interesting experience. You,on the other hand......... :-)ClifThe Early Bird may get the worm but the secondmouse gets the cheese. A small item...straight axle caps. I machined these from aluminum round bar stock,Come owwwwn now, someone has to have some pictures to share! If God is your co-pilot, switch seats Mike Perez________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2014 00:18:45 -0700

Original Posted By: "AircamperN11MS"
Jack is 100% correct. You can do what ever you want as far as repairs go. Therepairman Cert is for the "Condition Inspection" only. They are not call "annuals"on an experimental airplane. If you make any major changes to your plane like going from a Model A to a Contengine you would need to comply with what ever your "Operating Limitations" say.The newer ones generally only require a 5 hour fly off in your designatedarea. My plane requires a 40 hour fly off. I have a very old set of "operatingLimitations".Clear as mud now, Right?--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: horizontal stabilizer and fuselage

Original Posted By: "AircamperN11MS"
Thanks, Scott. Now I see. You have some interesting "stuff" in the rear of thatplane!Thanks,Ray KrauseSent from my iPad> On Aug 22, 2014, at 8:03 AM, "AircamperN11MS" wrote:> > > Ray,> > If you look closely you can see the stitching. Still difficult to see though.> > --------> Scott Liefeld> Flying N11MS since March 1972> Steel Tube> C-85-12> Wire Wheels> Brodhead in 1996> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 091#429091> > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/piet_106_114.jpg> http://forums.matronics.com//files/piet_107_124.jpg> > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: horizontal stabilizer and fuselage

Original Posted By: "Don.h(at)wcoil.com"
Oh, all the secret stuff isn't secret any more, or is it? What could all thatstrange stuff do? Here's a hint. The black bell crank "rights the wrongs".--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2014 12:09:16 -0400

Original Posted By: AMsafetyC(at)aol.com
I need one, maybe many, of those!Ray Krause Sent from my iPad> On Aug 22, 2014, at 9:00 AM, "AircamperN11MS" wrote:> > > Oh, all the secret stuff isn't secret any more, or is it? What could all thatstrange stuff do? Here's a hint. The black bell crank "rights the wrongs".> > --------> Scott Liefeld> Flying N11MS since March 1972> Steel Tube> C-85-12> Wire Wheels> Brodhead in 1996> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 103#429103> > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________