Brodhead Pietenpol Association

Original Posted By: "Harvey Plummer"
Thanks for the compliment Rick. You have certainly built a nice looking Piet yourself.I have been following your build for some time now looking for ideas asyou were a lot farther along than me. My performance figures have changed a little from what I first posted. I now have30 hours on the engine and here is what I am getting now. WOT level flight 2800 RPM, just shy of 100 mph indicatedWOT climb out 2675 RPM, 65 mph = about 700 fpm climb at 60 deg2200 rpm cruise = 75 mph2100 rpm cruise = 65 mphThe indicated airspeeds agree with my onboard gps pretty close.What rpm's are you running to get 65 to 75 mph in cruise?Rick SchreiberNX478RSPorter Co Regional, Valparaiso INRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Vertical Offset w/Corvair

Original Posted By: "Rick Schreiber"
Did you guys with a corvair engine offset the front of your vertical stabilizer1/2" - 3/4" to the left like I have seen those with A65 or O200 engine did? Rick Schreiber did you offset yours? Results?Thanks.--------Harv, 485PBRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/Corvair

Original Posted By: "Harvey Plummer"
Harv,No I didn't offset mine, consequently I always have to input a little left rudderin cruise. My plan is to take core of the offset this winter.Rick SchreiberNX478RSPorter Co Regional, Valparaiso INRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/Corvair

Original Posted By: "taildrags"
So Rick, does the front of the vertical stabilizer need to be offset to the leftor the right with the Corvair engine?--------Harv, 485PBRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/Corvair

Original Posted By: "Charles N. Campbell"
So let's think about this. We're above Rick's airplane looking down on it as he'sflying. The nose wants to pull to the right, so Rick is applying left rudderto keep the airplane going straight. As he presses left rudder, the cableon that side pulls the port side rudder horn and the rudder deflects to port,which causes the tail to swing to starboard and bring the nose straight. Lookingdown on the airplane, it rotates counter-clockwise to bring the nose straight.So what do we have to do to the leading edge of the vertical stabilizer to getthat same counter-clockwise rotation? We offset it to starboard so that moreof the port side is presented to the relative wind, 'pressing' the tail to starboard.The LE of the vertical stabilizer on my airplane, which has a Continentalengine that rotates in the opposite direction from the Corvair, is offset1/2" to the port side but still needs a small rudder trim tab. I think 3/4"offset would have been better, but I worried about twisting the vertical stabilizerbeam too much by doing that.There is a picture of the offset on my LE here: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_ ... -----Oscar ZunigaMedford, ORAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"A75 power, 72x36 Culver propRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: "Charles N. Campbell"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/CorvairOscar, why not make you some new L-shaped brackets to go on the top rear ofthe vertical stabilizer and twist them the correct number of degrees. Thatway the vertical piece in the stabilizer would not be twisted at all. ChuckOn Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 10:58 PM, taildrags wrote:>> So let's think about this. We're above Rick's airplane looking down on it> as he's flying. The nose wants to pull to the right, so Rick is applying> left rudder to keep the airplane going straight. As he presses left> rudder, the cable on that side pulls the port side rudder horn and the> rudder deflects to port, which causes the tail to swing to starboard and> bring the nose straight. Looking down on the airplane, it rotates> counter-clockwise to bring the nose straight.>> So what do we have to do to the leading edge of the vertical stabilizer to> get that same counter-clockwise rotation? We offset it to starboard so> that more of the port side is presented to the relative wind, 'pressing'> the tail to starboard. The LE of the vertical stabilizer on my airplane,> which has a Continental engine that rotates in the opposite direction from> the Corvair, is offset 1/2" to the port side but still needs a small rudder> trim tab. I think 3/4" offset would have been better, but I worried about> twisting the vertical stabilizer beam too much by doing that.>> There is a picture of the offset on my LE here:> http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_1848_571.jpg>> --------> Oscar Zuniga> Medford, OR> Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"> A75 power, 72x36 Culver prop>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: "jarheadpilot82"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/CorvairOscar, I just drew a diagram and did a bit of trig. The angle yopu wouldhave to twist the vertical brackets would be 1.4 degrees. ChuckOn Tue, Jan 17, 2017 at 10:58 PM, taildrags wrote:>> So let's think about this. We're above Rick's airplane looking down on it> as he's flying. The nose wants to pull to the right, so Rick is applying> left rudder to keep the airplane going straight. As he presses left> rudder, the cable on that side pulls the port side rudder horn and the> rudder deflects to port, which causes the tail to swing to starboard and> bring the nose straight. Looking down on the airplane, it rotates> counter-clockwise to bring the nose straight.>> So what do we have to do to the leading edge of the vertical stabilizer to> get that same counter-clockwise rotation? We offset it to starboard so> that more of the port side is presented to the relative wind, 'pressing'> the tail to starboard. The LE of the vertical stabilizer on my airplane,> which has a Continental engine that rotates in the opposite direction from> the Corvair, is offset 1/2" to the port side but still needs a small rudder> trim tab. I think 3/4" offset would have been better, but I worried about> twisting the vertical stabilizer beam too much by doing that.>> There is a picture of the offset on my LE here:> http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_1848_571.jpg>> --------> Oscar Zuniga> Medford, OR> Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"> A75 power, 72x36 Culver prop>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/Corvair

Original Posted By: Semih Oksay
Oscar,Excellent explanation. Very clear, logical, and concise. Nicely done.Chuck,Again, how old are you? I am 59 and I have forgotten how to spell Trig, much lessdo it. You are my hero, and I want to be like you when I grow up. But beinga professional air line pilot, I may never accomplish that (grow up, that is.)[Wink] [Laughing]--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: Scott Knowlton
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/CorvairTerry, if the Lord lets me live another month (Feb. 18), I'll be 93. I'msix months older than George Bush senior. George has the honor of beingthe youngest person to have finished Navy flight school. Before he camealong, I had that honor. I finished Flight school in Corpus Cristi, Tex onSeptember 8, 1943, at the ripe old age of 19.My Piet is almost finished. As soon as I figure how to run the throttleand mixture control lines and do it, I'll cover the fuselage, paint it,install the metal fire wall, and put it all together. The wing panels andtail surfaces (the tail surfaces and ailerons still need paint) are readyto be bolted on. I'll send some pictures if anyone is interested.ChuckOn Wed, Jan 18, 2017 at 10:48 AM, jarheadpilot82 wrote:> jarheadpilot82(at)hotmail.com>>> Oscar,>> Excellent explanation. Very clear, logical, and concise. Nicely done.>> Chuck,>> Again, how old are you? I am 59 and I have forgotten how to spell Trig,> much less do it. You are my hero, and I want to be like you when I grow up.> But being a professional air line pilot, I may never accomplish that (grow> up, that is.) [Wink] [Laughing]>> --------> Semper Fi,>> Terry Hand> Athens, GA>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: Steven Dortch
Please post some pictures CharlesScott KOn Jan 19, 2017, at 6:48 AM, Charles N. Campbell > wrote:Terry, if the Lord lets me live another month (Feb. 18), I'll be 93. I'm six months older than George Bush senior. George has the honor of being the youngest person to have finished Navy flight school. Before he came along, I had that honor. I finished Flight school in Corpus Cristi, Tex on September 8, 1943, at the ripe old age of 19.My Piet is almost finished. As soon as I figure how to run the throttle and mixture control lines and do it, I'll cover the fuselage, paint it, install the metal fire wall, and put it all together. The wing panels and tail surfaces (the tail surfaces and ailerons still need paint) are ready to be bolted on. I'll send some pictures if anyone is interested.ChuckOn Wed, Jan 18, 2017 at 10:48 AM, jarheadpilot82 > wrote:ail.com>Oscar,Excellent explanation. Very clear, logical, and concise. Nicely done.Chuck,Again, how old are you? I am 59 and I have forgotten how to spell Trig, much less do it. You are my hero, and I want to be like you when I grow up. But being a professional air line pilot, I may never accomplish that (grow up, that is.) [Wink] [Laughing]--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 7#465187br> enpol-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-ListFORUMS -eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.comWIKI -errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.comb Site - -Matt Dralle, List Admin.rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution__ ... __________

Original Posted By: Steven Dortch
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/CorvairChuck, where are you? I am in San Antonio and will be unable to work onanything due to a wing surgery (mine not a planes) I might want to cometake a look.Yes send pics and include one of the young cadet. I'll bet you were youngand pretty.Don't give up on the airline pilot dream. There is a huge pilot shortageand perhaps you can get a waiver! (LOL)Blue Skies,Steve DOn Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 6:02 AM, Scott Knowlton wrote:> Please post some pictures Charles>> Scott K>> On Jan 19, 2017, at 6:48 AM, Charles N. Campbell charlescampbell1924(at)gmail.com> wrote:>> Terry, if the Lord lets me live another month (Feb. 18), I'll be 93. I'm> six months older than George Bush senior. George has the honor of being> the youngest person to have finished Navy flight school. Before he came> along, I had that honor. I finished Flight school in Corpus Cristi, Tex on> September 8, 1943, at the ripe old age of 19.>> My Piet is almost finished. As soon as I figure how to run the throttle> and mixture control lines and do it, I'll cover the fuselage, paint it,> install the metal fire wall, and put it all together. The wing panels and> tail surfaces (the tail surfaces and ailerons still need paint) are ready> to be bolted on. I'll send some pictures if anyone is interested.>> Chuck>> On Wed, Jan 18, 2017 at 10:48 AM, jarheadpilot82 jarheadpilot82(at)hotmail.com> wrote:>>> jarheadpilot82(at)hotmail.com>>>>> Oscar,>>>> Excellent explanation. Very clear, logical, and concise. Nicely done.>>>> Chuck,>>>> Again, how old are you? I am 59 and I have forgotten how to spell Trig,>> much less do it. You are my hero, and I want to be like you when I grow up.>> But being a professional air line pilot, I may never accomplish that (grow>> up, that is.) [Wink] [Laughing]>>>> -------->> Semper Fi,>>>> Terry Hand>> Athens, GA>>>>>>>>>> Read this topic online here:>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 187#465187>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===================================>> br> enpol-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.>> matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>> ===================================>> FORUMS ->> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com>> ===================================>> WIKI ->> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com>> ===================================>> b Site ->> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.>> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution>> ===================================>>>>>>>>>-- Blue Skies,Steve D________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: "taildrags"
Jerry; to answer your question, I have not done this so, my comments are generalonly. My airplane has a Continental A75 up front.The original Air Camper had the water-cooled Ford "A" engine up front and had theshortest length fuselage of the common variants. Many have noted that moremodern Air Campers have tended to be tail-heavy, and no doubt some of that isdue to extending the fuselage aft of the firewall by stretching the cockpitsor extending the empennage. You say you are rebuilding a long-fuse Piet, so areyou actually reworking the fuselage or are you just thinking about the motormounts and things that are ahead of the firewall? I think your starting pointshould be to research what the weight of the conventional Ford "A" engine conversionis, including radiator and coolant system, and use that as your basisfor comparison. It sounds like you may want to keep your firewall-forward packageat least as heavy as the original, and think about where it's going tomount.The standard Air Camper has cabane struts that pivot at both ends, which allowsthe wing to be shifted aft to correct (or adjust) an aft CG, but only withinlimits.--------Oscar ZunigaMedford, ORAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"A75 power, 72x36 Culver propRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/Corvair

Original Posted By: "aviken"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/CorvairSorry for the delay -- I haven't been home (near my computer). I'm inSalisbury, North Carolina. It's about 40 miles NE of Charlotte, NC. Mypictures are scattered through my main computer, an electronic tablet, andmy cell phone. I am going to have to have one of my computer expertgrandsons tell me how to gather them all together in my desk computer. Assoon as we can do that, I will get some pics on the net. ChuckOn Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 10:13 AM, Steven Dortch wrote:> Chuck, where are you? I am in San Antonio and will be unable to work on> anything due to a wing surgery (mine not a planes) I might want to come> take a look.> Yes send pics and include one of the young cadet. I'll bet you were young> and pretty.> Don't give up on the airline pilot dream. There is a huge pilot shortage> and perhaps you can get a waiver! (LOL)>> Blue Skies,> Steve D>>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2017 at 6:02 AM, Scott Knowlton > wrote:>>> Please post some pictures Charles>>>> Scott K>>>> On Jan 19, 2017, at 6:48 AM, Charles N. Campbell > charlescampbell1924(at)gmail.com> wrote:>>>> Terry, if the Lord lets me live another month (Feb. 18), I'll be 93. I'm>> six months older than George Bush senior. George has the honor of being>> the youngest person to have finished Navy flight school. Before he came>> along, I had that honor. I finished Flight school in Corpus Cristi, Tex on>> September 8, 1943, at the ripe old age of 19.>>>> My Piet is almost finished. As soon as I figure how to run the throttle>> and mixture control lines and do it, I'll cover the fuselage, paint it,>> install the metal fire wall, and put it all together. The wing panels and>> tail surfaces (the tail surfaces and ailerons still need paint) are ready>> to be bolted on. I'll send some pictures if anyone is interested.>>>> Chuck>>>> On Wed, Jan 18, 2017 at 10:48 AM, jarheadpilot82 > jarheadpilot82(at)hotmail.com> wrote:>>>>> jarheadpilot82(at)hotmail.com>>>>>>> Oscar,>>>>>> Excellent explanation. Very clear, logical, and concise. Nicely done.>>>>>> Chuck,>>>>>> Again, how old are you? I am 59 and I have forgotten how to spell Trig,>>> much less do it. You are my hero, and I want to be like you when I grow up.>>> But being a professional air line pilot, I may never accomplish that (grow>>> up, that is.) [Wink] [Laughing]>>>>>> -------->>> Semper Fi,>>>>>> Terry Hand>>> Athens, GA>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Read this topic online here:>>>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 187#465187>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ==========>>> br> enpol-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.mat>>> ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>>> ==========>>> FORUMS ->>> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com>>> ==========>>> WIKI ->>> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com>>> ==========>>> b Site ->>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.>>> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution>>> ==========>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --> Blue Skies,> Steve D>________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spring Landing Gear designs

Original Posted By: Ben Charvet
I built my gear using the WW die spring method. I got my springs form ASand built them close to his plans as possible . I did connect mine to the landinggear attatchment point and not to a center v as some do . I have been veryhappy with the set upRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/land ... __________

Original Posted By: "Charles N. Campbell"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/CorvairOscar, I just hope my Piet gets flown before I pass to the greathereafter! I think I'll make it, but then there is a possibility that Iwon't. ChuckOn Sat, Jan 21, 2017 at 10:52 PM, taildrags wrote:>> Chuck: the reason I didn't want to mess with moving or fabricating new> rear L-brackets for the aft edge of the vertical stabilizer was "laziness"> ;o) Yes, I could do that and accommodate another 1.4 degrees of twist> without worrying about the wood spar. I know you think that slight angle> of rotation sounds insignificant, but when you push the leading edge of the> VS over and watch the rear spar stay fixed as everything else tightens up,> you start thinking about the glue joints and everything else, and I didn't> like the feeling as I pushed it over past the 1/2" that I gave it.>> By the way, the builder of my Piet, Corky Corbett, will also be 93 this> year (I believe)- but he completed and flew NX41CC as a much younger man> than you... he was only 80 ;o)>> --------> Oscar Zuniga> Medford, OR> Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"> A75 power, 72x36 Culver prop>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________

Original Posted By: "jarheadpilot82"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spring Landing Gear designsTerry, I clicked on each of the attachments and the matronics listing andgot a 'article does not exist' on all four items. Anyone else have anysuccess? ChuckOn Sun, Jan 22, 2017 at 6:59 PM, jarheadpilot82 wrote:> jarheadpilot82(at)hotmail.com>>> Ben,>> I had posted this on the Pietvair forum a while back. But since you are> unable to see that, I am sharing here. The spring shown is the one I used,> and it is a good bit cheaper than what can be found elsewhere.>> I hope the info helps.>> --------> Semper Fi,>> Terry Hand> Athens, GA>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 353#465353>>> Attachments:>> http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_6219_837.jpg> http://forums.matronics.com//files/die_spring_gear_> measurements_dragged_1_156.pdf> http://forums.matronics.com//files/die_ ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spring Landing Gear designs

Original Posted By: "Charles N. Campbell"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/CorvairAre you the Charles Campbell who spoke at the Redbird symposium at SanMarcos?On Jan 23, 2017 7:54 AM, "Charles N. Campbell" wrote:> Oscar, I just hope my Piet gets flown before I pass to the great> hereafter! I think I'll make it, but then there is a possibility that I> won't. Chuck>> On Sat, Jan 21, 2017 at 10:52 PM, taildrags wrote:>>>>> Chuck: the reason I didn't want to mess with moving or fabricating new>> rear L-brackets for the aft edge of the vertical stabilizer was "laziness">> ;o) Yes, I could do that and accommodate another 1.4 degrees of twist>> without worrying about the wood spar. I know you think that slight angle>> of rotation sounds insignificant, but when you push the leading edge of the>> VS over and watch the rear spar stay fixed as everything else tightens up,>> you start thinking about the glue joints and everything else, and I didn't>> like the feeling as I pushed it over past the 1/2" that I gave it.>>>> By the way, the builder of my Piet, Corky Corbett, will also be 93 this>> year (I believe)- but he completed and flew NX41CC as a much younger man>> than you... he was only 80 ;o)>>>> -------->> Oscar Zuniga>> Medford, OR>> Air Camper NX41CC "Scout">> A75 power, 72x36 Culver prop>>>>>>>>>> Read this topic online here:>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 322#465322>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===================================>> br> enpol-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.>> matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>> ===================================>> FORUMS ->> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com>> ===================================>> WIKI ->> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com>> ===================================>> b Site ->> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.>> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution>> ===================================>>>>>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________

Original Posted By: Steven Dortch
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vertical Offset w/CorvairNo, sorry. That brought up an interesting memory. When I joined the USNavy in 1941 I had to have a birth certificate. Mother didn't have one soI went to the office of vital statistics in Raleigh NC to get one. I toldthe clerk my name and he went back to the record section. He came backwith a handful of certificates and handed them to me and said, "Take yourpick." There were more than a dozen Charles Campbells in North Carolinaalone -- no telling how many in the US. ChuckOn Mon, Jan 23, 2017 at 10:16 AM, Steven Dortch wrote:> Are you the Charles Campbell who spoke at the Redbird symposium at San> Marcos?>> On Jan 23, 2017 7:54 AM, "Charles N. Campbell" charlescampbell1924(at)gmail.com> wrote:>>> Oscar, I just hope my Piet gets flown before I pass to the great>> hereafter! I think I'll make it, but then there is a possibility that I>> won't. Chuck>>>> On Sat, Jan 21, 2017 at 10:52 PM, taildrags >> wrote:>>>>> >>>>>>> Chuck: the reason I didn't want to mess with moving or fabricating new>>> rear L-brackets for the aft edge of the vertical stabilizer was "laziness">>> ;o) Yes, I could do that and accommodate another 1.4 degrees of twist>>> without worrying about the wood spar. I know you think that slight angle>>> of rotation sounds insignificant, but when you push the leading edge of the>>> VS over and watch the rear spar stay fixed as everything else tightens up,>>> you start thinking about the glue joints and everything else, and I didn't>>> like the feeling as I pushed it over past the 1/2" that I gave it.>>>>>> By the way, the builder of my Piet, Corky Corbett, will also be 93 this>>> year (I believe)- but he completed and flew NX41CC as a much younger man>>> than you... he was only 80 ;o)>>>>>> -------->>> Oscar Zuniga>>> Medford, OR>>> Air Camper NX41CC "Scout">>> A75 power, 72x36 Culver prop>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Read this topic online here:>>>>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 322#465322>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ==========>>> br> enpol-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.mat>>> ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>>> ==========>>> FORUMS ->>> eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com>>> ==========>>> WIKI ->>> errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com>>> ==========>>> b Site ->>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.>>> rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution>>> ==========>>>>>>>>>>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________