Pietenpol-List: sitka grades

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Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: sitka grades>I used an Arrow electric staple gun when I built my cedar stripper canoe.>Staples were used to hold the 1/4"x1" cedar strips together while the glue>cured. The stapler was about $30 CDN ($20 USD) and was certainly>durable enough (3 boxes of staples had little effect on it). There were>three problems with the electric stapler in that application:>>1. Not enough power. I felt like Tim Taylor looking for a way to add MORE>POWER (RRR RRR RRR). It worked OK with 1/2" staples but there wasnt enough>power to staple the 1/4" strips into the oak stem using the 3/4" staples.>Air powered will probably work better. Crank it up to 200 PSI and you'll>probably get a good 1000 yds range! I could only get the staples to stick>into the wall at less than 10' with my wimpy gun This brings up>another point. Wear eye protection (and maybe a cup just in case .>>2. It was hard to accurately figure out where the staples would end up. I>finally resorted to marking guide lines on the sides and front of teh>stapler to help with placing the staples where I wanted them.>>3. Glue! Since I was edge gluing the planks together in a cove and bead>seam, the glue would run out over the sides as I stapled. It would get all>over the bottom of the stapler. Fortunately, the glue was water soluable>and easily washed off. T-88 may not be so forgiving. Granted, you probably>wont have near the amount of excess glue on a wing rib.>>Ken>>On Thu, 26 Aug 1999, del magsam wrote:>>> my plans are on the table and ready to start. Any>> comments on using grade c and better sitka spruce for>> every thing with the exception of the spars? c and>> better is pretty clean and of course you would not>> use any piece with a swirl or knot. What are the pros>> and cons of the long fuse verses the short? Also has>> anybody used air powered staples to assemble the ribs>> etc? one more question, is baltic birch too heavy or>> not strong enough for the ply's? thanks in advance.>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>Calgary, Alberta, Canada>Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>>>________________________________________________________________________________

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Original Posted By: "Davis, Marc"
my plans are on the table and ready to start. Anycomments on using grade c and better sitka spruce forevery thing with the exception of the spars? c andbetter is pretty clean and of course you would notuse any piece with a swirl or knot. What are the prosand cons of the long fuse verses the short? Also hasanybody used air powered staples to assemble the ribsetc? one more question, is baltic birch too heavy ornot strong enough for the ply's? thanks in advance.________________________________________________________________________________

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Original Posted By: walter evans
I used an Arrow electric staple gun when I built my cedar stripper canoe.Staples were used to hold the 1/4"x1" cedar strips together while the gluecured. The stapler was about $30 CDN ($20 USD) and was certainlydurable enough (3 boxes of staples had little effect on it). There werethree problems with the electric stapler in that application:1. Not enough power. I felt like Tim Taylor looking for a way to add MOREPOWER (RRR RRR RRR). It worked OK with 1/2" staples but there wasnt enoughpower to staple the 1/4" strips into the oak stem using the 3/4" staples.Air powered will probably work better. Crank it up to 200 PSI and you'llprobably get a good 1000 yds range! I could only get the staples to stickinto the wall at less than 10' with my wimpy gun This brings upanother point. Wear eye protection (and maybe a cup just in case .2. It was hard to accurately figure out where the staples would end up. Ifinally resorted to marking guide lines on the sides and front of tehstapler to help with placing the staples where I wanted them.3. Glue! Since I was edge gluing the planks together in a cove and beadseam, the glue would run out over the sides as I stapled. It would get allover the bottom of the stapler. Fortunately, the glue was water soluableand easily washed off. T-88 may not be so forgiving. Granted, you probablywont have near the amount of excess glue on a wing rib.KenOn Thu, 26 Aug 1999, del magsam wrote:> my plans are on the table and ready to start. Any> comments on using grade c and better sitka spruce for> every thing with the exception of the spars? c and> better is pretty clean and of course you would not> use any piece with a swirl or knot. What are the pros> and cons of the long fuse verses the short? Also has> anybody used air powered staples to assemble the ribs> etc? one more question, is baltic birch too heavy or> not strong enough for the ply's? thanks in advance.> > > > > > > Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)Calgary, Alberta, CanadaChristavia MK 1 C-GREN________________________________________________________________________________

[matronics]

Original Posted By: LaurenMWilliams(at)webtv.net (Lauren Williams)
I tried using both electric and hand staplers for gussets on the ribs. Inever got past the test stage. The staplers where just too brutal anapproach. not accurate in positioning and unless round wire staples areused, too destructive of the spruce cap strip.I used brass coated aircraft nails, T-88 Epoxy, and cut the gussets topatterns for each position on the rib. To set the nails, I pre- prickedthe outer nail locations with an awl, tapped the nails in enough to markthe rib material, lifted the gussets off and glued. Then I put thegusset back in place with the nails in their former indentations andtapped them home. I then pricked the positions of the rest of the nailson the gusset and set them one at a time.I put furniture oil on the rib jig, as a parting agent, weeks beforeusing it and left the rib in the jig until the glue set over night.So, when I went out in the garage to do a rib, I'd plug in the electricteapot to steam the forward end of another cap strip. Then I would takethe set rib out of the jig and hang it up on the rack on the wall,taking great satisfaction in the growing evidence of Airplane! Then Iwould take the dry upper cap out of the pre-bending jig and insert it inthe rib jig. The lower capstrip snapped into place and I would then cutthe vertical and angled struts to fit in each space. I had precutgussets in stacks along the back of the workbench and could ready themwith their guiding nails, using the awl to prick the plywood, fairlyquickly. Once all of the gussets where located by their 'guide' nails, Iwould lift them off one at a time, glue and then secure them, aspreviously mentioned. Somewhere along the way, I would turn off theteapot and put the limber cap strip into the pre-bending jig. The process of figuring out how, and in what order, to do the work hasbeen one of the greatest satisfactions of the building process. I didthe ribs first and then the tail surfaces. I bought the wood as I neededit for each individual group of parts.I put off building an airplane for a lot of years because I thought thatmy craftsmanship wasn't up to the standards that I would want in anairplane. I found that that concern took care of itself when I startedto build.I find Aircraft Quality spruce and plywood to be inspiring materials towork. Part of this inspiration to do fine work comes from the way thewoods feel under the blade of an edged tool, like a plane, hard back sawor chisel. Part of it is the wonderful appearance of the finished parts.I also include the monetary value of the material as a prod toward clearthinking and craftsmanship. Given the choice, I would spend a very great part of my time buildingairplane. Unfortunately, life intrudes now and then with other demands. Lauren________________________________________________________________________________

[matronics]

Original Posted By: Matt Kirk
I won't comment on the sitka spruce, except to say, look up the specs and go from there. And...a few years ago in the Boeing air museum they had on display an old aircraft spar.The spar had a graIN drop of about 3 inches in about 6 inches distance.About baltic birch , I used it for gussets, and found that the glassey surface would not give a solid glue joint. I solved this by giving the surface to be glued a good roughing so as to allow some tooth for the glueing surface.>From: Ken Beanlands >Reply-To: Pietenpol Discussion >To: Pietenpol Discussion >Subject: Re: sitka grades>Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 13:40:30 -0600 (MDT)>>I used an Arrow electric staple gun when I built my cedar stripper canoe.>Staples were used to hold the 1/4"x1" cedar strips together while the glue>cured. The stapler was about $30 CDN ($20 USD) and was certainly>durable enough (3 boxes of staples had little effect on it). There were>three problems with the electric stapler in that application:>>1. Not enough power. I felt like Tim Taylor looking for a way to add MORE>POWER (RRR RRR RRR). It worked OK with 1/2" staples but there wasnt enough>power to staple the 1/4" strips into the oak stem using the 3/4" staples.>Air powered will probably work better. Crank it up to 200 PSI and you'll>probably get a good 1000 yds range! I could only get the staples to stick>into the wall at less than 10' with my wimpy gun This brings up>another point. Wear eye protection (and maybe a cup just in case .>>2. It was hard to accurately figure out where the staples would end up. I>finally resorted to marking guide lines on the sides and front of teh>stapler to help with placing the staples where I wanted them.>>3. Glue! Since I was edge gluing the planks together in a cove and bead>seam, the glue would run out over the sides as I stapled. It would get all>over the bottom of the stapler. Fortunately, the glue was water soluable>and easily washed off. T-88 may not be so forgiving. Granted, you probably>wont have near the amount of excess glue on a wing rib.>>Ken>>On Thu, 26 Aug 1999, del magsam wrote:>> > my plans are on the table and ready to start. Any> > comments on using grade c and better sitka spruce for> > every thing with the exception of the spars? c and> > better is pretty clean and of course you would not> > use any piece with a swirl or knot. What are the pros> > and cons of the long fuse verses the short? Also has> > anybody used air powered staples to assemble the ribs> > etc? one more question, is baltic birch too heavy or> > not strong enough for the ply's? thanks in advance.> >> >> >> >> >> > > >>>Ken Beanlands B.Eng (Aerospace)>Calgary, Alberta, Canada>Christavia MK 1 C-GREN>>>________________________________________________________________________________

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Original Posted By: Ken Beanlands
A cup is not a bad idea when it comes to staplers.I was using a air powered stapler on my first Piet tail section. I wasusing 40 lbs of air pressure.One day I went into the shop to work and I didn't realize my son hadadjusted the air pressure up to 120psi.I got ready to set a staple and used the stapler. After I pressed thebutton there was a small hole but no staple.So I did it again. Still no staple. So I checked for a jammed staple, butthere was none.So I tried it again. Still a hole. This time though I thought to myselfthere seems to be alot of air kicked out of the vent when I stapled thattime. So I checked the air pressure and found it was set high. I looked onthe backof the wood and sure enough you could see where the staple had sliced allthe way through.After I fixed everthing and finished my work I went into bed.(didn't replacewood but filled holes with T-88)When I was pulling my boots off I noticed two nice little staples stickingin one toe. I thought I sure was gladI had my boots on. Then I thought I'm sure glad I wasn't sitting down andworking in my lap.Still never figured out where the third staple went. But I bought a morecomfortable pair of safety glasses with side covers so I would be sure towear them everytime. Didn't want everyone to think a one eyed pirate wasflying around in an Air Camper.Greg Yotz-----Original Message-----