Original Posted By: WTH Service and Restorations Inc.
I bougtht boat building wood from a supplierin Sidney B.C., Douglas Fir and I'll say the qualityis on par with anything. and here's the good part $4.00 a board foot. completly clear, grainrun from one end of the 20' board to the other!just go on the net do search on boat buildinglumber (+lumber +boat +building) talkto Jan the guy from Norway! GET YOU PLY THERETO! RUSSELL ----- Original Message ----- ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Piet wingtip
Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
Has anyone out there in (PAN) Pietenpol Area Network everreinforced the outer rib in the event of a ground loop? I wasconsidering extruding a small piece of aluminum in case the wingtip hit the run way may be it would act as a skid and prevent damage? Russell----- Original Message -----________________________________________________________________________________
Has anyone out there in (PAN) Pietenpol Area Network everreinforced the outer rib in the event of a ground loop? I wasconsidering extruding a small piece of aluminum in case the wingtip hit the run way may be it would act as a skid and prevent damage? Russell----- Original Message -----________________________________________________________________________________
Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: del magsam
Subject: Piet wingtip I have a question for you way advanced guys. On the wingtip thecenterline of the spar ends don't line up to the leading and trailingedges. What did you guys do? Cut the shape out of wide 5/4", then shapeit? thanks walt________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Piet wingtip I have a question for you way advanced guys. On the wingtip thecenterline of the spar ends don't line up to the leading and trailingedges. What did you guys do? Cut the shape out of wide 5/4", then shapeit? thanks walt________________________________________________________________________________
Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Alan Swanson
Subject: Piet wingtip I have a question for you way advanced guys. On the wingtip thecenterline of the spar ends don't line up to the leading and trailingedges. What did you guys do? Cut the shape out of wide 5/4", then shapeit? thanks walt________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Piet wingtip I have a question for you way advanced guys. On the wingtip thecenterline of the spar ends don't line up to the leading and trailingedges. What did you guys do? Cut the shape out of wide 5/4", then shapeit? thanks walt________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: walter evans
Subject: Re: Piet wingtip Walt; On my Scout (same tips as the AC), the tip "bow" is a compoundcurve of sorts as it comes outta the LE, turns and goes up kindafollowing the curve of the top of the rib then down and back into theTE. Mine are laminated of 3x 1/4" pieces blended into (spliced) thehoriz curved pieces out of plywood. There has to be a better way as theywere hard to make, but, the wing looks just like the drawing, pure Piet.They are quite strong too. There are no straight lines on the tipbowes............ Earl Myers
Subject: Re: Piet wingtip Walt; On my Scout (same tips as the AC), the tip "bow" is a compoundcurve of sorts as it comes outta the LE, turns and goes up kindafollowing the curve of the top of the rib then down and back into theTE. Mine are laminated of 3x 1/4" pieces blended into (spliced) thehoriz curved pieces out of plywood. There has to be a better way as theywere hard to make, but, the wing looks just like the drawing, pure Piet.They are quite strong too. There are no straight lines on the tipbowes............ Earl Myers
Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Earl Myers
Subject: Re: Piet wingtip Walt; On my Scout (same tips as the AC), the tip "bow" is a compoundcurve of sorts as it comes outta the LE, turns and goes up kindafollowing the curve of the top of the rib then down and back into theTE. Mine are laminated of 3x 1/4" pieces blended into (spliced) thehoriz curved pieces out of plywood. There has to be a better way as theywere hard to make, but, the wing looks just like the drawing, pure Piet.They are quite strong too. There are no straight lines on the tipbowes............ Earl Myersthe centerline of the spar ends don't line up to the leading andtrailing edges. What did you guys do? Cut the shape out of wide 5/4",then shape it?________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Piet wingtip Walt; On my Scout (same tips as the AC), the tip "bow" is a compoundcurve of sorts as it comes outta the LE, turns and goes up kindafollowing the curve of the top of the rib then down and back into theTE. Mine are laminated of 3x 1/4" pieces blended into (spliced) thehoriz curved pieces out of plywood. There has to be a better way as theywere hard to make, but, the wing looks just like the drawing, pure Piet.They are quite strong too. There are no straight lines on the tipbowes............ Earl Myersthe centerline of the spar ends don't line up to the leading andtrailing edges. What did you guys do? Cut the shape out of wide 5/4",then shape it?________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: "WTH Service and Restorations Inc."
Subject: Re: Piet wingtip You can kinda see what Earl is talking about in this picture. http://www.kans.com/gyachts/image4.jpg I'll try to get a better picture. Greg Yotz________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Piet wingtip You can kinda see what Earl is talking about in this picture. http://www.kans.com/gyachts/image4.jpg I'll try to get a better picture. Greg Yotz________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Earl Myers
Subject: Re: Piet wingtip Earl, Thanks. To look at the prints, I got the impression that it was a1x1 maybe steamed and bent. But the closer I looked , the stranger itlooked. Guess I'll have to put on my thinking cap for this one. walt
Subject: Re: Piet wingtip Earl, Thanks. To look at the prints, I got the impression that it was a1x1 maybe steamed and bent. But the closer I looked , the stranger itlooked. Guess I'll have to put on my thinking cap for this one. walt
Pietenpol-List: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: del magsam
I have a question for you way advanced guys. On the wingtip thecenterline of the spar ends don't line up to the leading and trailingedges. What did you guys do? Cut the shape out of wide 5/4", then shapeit?thankswaltI have a question for you wayadvancedguys. On the wingtip the centerline of the spar ends don't line upto theleading and trailing edges. What did you guys do? Cut the shapeout ofwide 5/4, then shape it?thanks walt________________________________________________________________________________
I have a question for you way advanced guys. On the wingtip thecenterline of the spar ends don't line up to the leading and trailingedges. What did you guys do? Cut the shape out of wide 5/4", then shapeit?thankswaltI have a question for you wayadvancedguys. On the wingtip the centerline of the spar ends don't line upto theleading and trailing edges. What did you guys do? Cut the shapeout ofwide 5/4, then shape it?thanks walt________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List:
Original Posted By: Greg Yotz
has anybody else had experience with getting sitkafrom oshkosh home center? I also have local sourcewhere I can buy c and better sitka, and they will letme pick thru it. where can I look to get the specs onaircraft quality lumber. or would it be better tojust pay the extra bucks and be on the safe side?________________________________________________________________________________
has anybody else had experience with getting sitkafrom oshkosh home center? I also have local sourcewhere I can buy c and better sitka, and they will letme pick thru it. where can I look to get the specs onaircraft quality lumber. or would it be better tojust pay the extra bucks and be on the safe side?________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: walter evans
Walt; On my Scout (same tips as the AC), the tip "bow" is a compound curve ofsorts as it comes outta the LE, turns and goes up kinda following thecurve of the top of the rib then down and back into the TE. Mine arelaminated of 3x 1/4" pieces blended into (spliced) the horiz curvedpieces out of plywood. There has to be a better way as they were hard tomake, but, the wing looks just like the drawing, pure Piet. They arequite strong too. There are no straight lines on the tipbowes............Earl Myers -----Original Message-----
Walt; On my Scout (same tips as the AC), the tip "bow" is a compound curve ofsorts as it comes outta the LE, turns and goes up kinda following thecurve of the top of the rib then down and back into the TE. Mine arelaminated of 3x 1/4" pieces blended into (spliced) the horiz curvedpieces out of plywood. There has to be a better way as they were hard tomake, but, the wing looks just like the drawing, pure Piet. They arequite strong too. There are no straight lines on the tipbowes............Earl Myers -----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: walter evans
You can kinda see what Earl is talking about in this picture.http://www.kans.com/gyachts/image4.jpgI'll try to get a better picture.Greg Yotz________________________________________________________________________________
You can kinda see what Earl is talking about in this picture.http://www.kans.com/gyachts/image4.jpgI'll try to get a better picture.Greg Yotz________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Earl Myers
Earl,Thanks. To look at the prints, I got the impression that it was a 1x1maybe steamed and bent. But the closer I looked , the stranger itlooked. Guess I'll have to put on my thinking cap for this one.walt -----Original Message-----
Earl,Thanks. To look at the prints, I got the impression that it was a 1x1maybe steamed and bent. But the closer I looked , the stranger itlooked. Guess I'll have to put on my thinking cap for this one.walt -----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re:
Original Posted By: kyle ray
Suggestion: You can shop and look around and you will still pay theprice. Buy your wood from Wicks or a another aircraft company. Its moreexpensive but- It's generally correct and carries a company warrenty forquality, Order the size you need, your waste will stay on yourfloor-mistakes too!, They will do the cutting and mill work, for thebasic size-That's worth a little extra.For the money you are ahead of the game. When folks say wood is cheaperat the lumber yard in comparison to a aircraft supply company apples andoranges are being compared. Also- there is value in using aircraft gradeand certified materials. ALOT OF VALUE.Tommy del magsam wrote:> > has anybody else had experience with getting sitka> from oshkosh home center? I also have local source> where I can buy c and better sitka, and they will let> me pick thru it. where can I look to get the specs on> aircraft quality lumber. or would it be better to> just pay the extra bucks and be on the safe side?> > -- WTH Service and Restorations, Inc. 6561 Commerce Court, Warrenton, VA 20187 Tel: (540)349-3034, Fax: (540)349-9652, Email:WTHauto(at)WTHrestorations.com________________________________________________________________________________
Suggestion: You can shop and look around and you will still pay theprice. Buy your wood from Wicks or a another aircraft company. Its moreexpensive but- It's generally correct and carries a company warrenty forquality, Order the size you need, your waste will stay on yourfloor-mistakes too!, They will do the cutting and mill work, for thebasic size-That's worth a little extra.For the money you are ahead of the game. When folks say wood is cheaperat the lumber yard in comparison to a aircraft supply company apples andoranges are being compared. Also- there is value in using aircraft gradeand certified materials. ALOT OF VALUE.Tommy del magsam wrote:> > has anybody else had experience with getting sitka> from oshkosh home center? I also have local source> where I can buy c and better sitka, and they will let> me pick thru it. where can I look to get the specs on> aircraft quality lumber. or would it be better to> just pay the extra bucks and be on the safe side?> > -- WTH Service and Restorations, Inc. 6561 Commerce Court, Warrenton, VA 20187 Tel: (540)349-3034, Fax: (540)349-9652, Email:WTHauto(at)WTHrestorations.com________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: walter evans
Walt; I can't really remember how I built those bows exactly as it was earlyin the game 6 years ago. They just flowed together.........Earl Myers -----Original Message-----
Walt; I can't really remember how I built those bows exactly as it was earlyin the game 6 years ago. They just flowed together.........Earl Myers -----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Greg Yotz
Walt; The picture here from Greg is EXACTLY what mine looks like ! Onlydifference is I have a one piece wing....they made good handles!Earl Myers -----Original Message-----
Walt; The picture here from Greg is EXACTLY what mine looks like ! Onlydifference is I have a one piece wing....they made good handles!Earl Myers -----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Greg Yotz
To make my wingtip bow I took a long piece of plywood and laid outa wing rib (already built) on it and traced it out...including the pointswhere the two spars and LE and TE centerlines are. I purchased cheappine lattice at the DIY store as I recall 1/4" x 1.5 or 2.0" wide and withoutsteam or water just bent them by hand to the 'centerline' and had ahelper draw a pencil line along one edge. Another line two thicknessesof the wood I chose above and below gave me a guide to work from.I drove 6 penny or so nails along the top curved line and bottom curvedline and just lathered up one lattice strip at a time an stuck it in mynail lined 'jig'. I snipped off the nail heads with a pair of diagonals tomakethe pieces go in and out easier. Each of the four lattice pieces was T-88'edand slipped into place. It took a wood block and mallet to force the last oneinto my 'jig'. Before any gluing took place I laid Saran wrap over thejig, pressedit down over the nails so I could use the jig twice. Once dry I ran the 1" thick laminated wingtip bow thru my table routerusing a1/2" radius round over bit on the outside of the bow to make a nice roundededge.The rest was planed down and sanded smooth. It took two trys, two differentjigs, to get these bows to line up with the LE, TE, and two spars, but the endresult was worth the effort. Strong as can be too.Mike C. ________________________________________________________________________________
To make my wingtip bow I took a long piece of plywood and laid outa wing rib (already built) on it and traced it out...including the pointswhere the two spars and LE and TE centerlines are. I purchased cheappine lattice at the DIY store as I recall 1/4" x 1.5 or 2.0" wide and withoutsteam or water just bent them by hand to the 'centerline' and had ahelper draw a pencil line along one edge. Another line two thicknessesof the wood I chose above and below gave me a guide to work from.I drove 6 penny or so nails along the top curved line and bottom curvedline and just lathered up one lattice strip at a time an stuck it in mynail lined 'jig'. I snipped off the nail heads with a pair of diagonals tomakethe pieces go in and out easier. Each of the four lattice pieces was T-88'edand slipped into place. It took a wood block and mallet to force the last oneinto my 'jig'. Before any gluing took place I laid Saran wrap over thejig, pressedit down over the nails so I could use the jig twice. Once dry I ran the 1" thick laminated wingtip bow thru my table routerusing a1/2" radius round over bit on the outside of the bow to make a nice roundededge.The rest was planed down and sanded smooth. It took two trys, two differentjigs, to get these bows to line up with the LE, TE, and two spars, but the endresult was worth the effort. Strong as can be too.Mike C. ________________________________________________________________________________
> Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
>Thats a good laminated wingtip Mike!>I bet that sucker is strong and tuff!>>Greg Yotz>>>-----Original Message----->From: Michael D Cuy >To: Pietenpol Discussion >Date: Tuesday, September 07, 1999 9:12 AM>Subject: Re: Piet wingtip>>>>To make my wingtip bow I took a long piece of plywood and laid out>>a wing rib (already built) on it and traced it out...including the points>>where the two spars and LE and TE centerlines are. I purchased cheap>>pine lattice at the DIY store as I recall 1/4" x 1.5 or 2.0" wide and>without>>steam or water just bent them by hand to the 'centerline' and had a>>helper draw a pencil line along one edge. Another line two thicknesses>>of the wood I chose above and below gave me a guide to work from.>>I drove 6 penny or so nails along the top curved line and bottom curved>>line and just lathered up one lattice strip at a time an stuck it in my>>nail lined 'jig'. I snipped off the nail heads with a pair of diagonalsto>>make>>the pieces go in and out easier. Each of the four lattice pieces was>T-88'ed>>and slipped into place. It took a wood block and mallet to force the last>one>>into my 'jig'. Before any gluing took place I laid Saran wrap over the>>jig, pressed>>it down over the nails so I could use the jig twice.>> Once dry I ran the 1" thick laminated wingtip bow thru my table router>>using a>>1/2" radius round over bit on the outside of the bow to make a nicerounded>>edge.>>The rest was planed down and sanded smooth. It took two trys, two>different>>jigs, to get these bows to line up with the LE, TE, and two spars, butthe>end>>result was worth the effort. Strong as can be too.>>>>Mike C.>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________
>Thats a good laminated wingtip Mike!>I bet that sucker is strong and tuff!>>Greg Yotz>>>-----Original Message----->From: Michael D Cuy >To: Pietenpol Discussion >Date: Tuesday, September 07, 1999 9:12 AM>Subject: Re: Piet wingtip>>>>To make my wingtip bow I took a long piece of plywood and laid out>>a wing rib (already built) on it and traced it out...including the points>>where the two spars and LE and TE centerlines are. I purchased cheap>>pine lattice at the DIY store as I recall 1/4" x 1.5 or 2.0" wide and>without>>steam or water just bent them by hand to the 'centerline' and had a>>helper draw a pencil line along one edge. Another line two thicknesses>>of the wood I chose above and below gave me a guide to work from.>>I drove 6 penny or so nails along the top curved line and bottom curved>>line and just lathered up one lattice strip at a time an stuck it in my>>nail lined 'jig'. I snipped off the nail heads with a pair of diagonalsto>>make>>the pieces go in and out easier. Each of the four lattice pieces was>T-88'ed>>and slipped into place. It took a wood block and mallet to force the last>one>>into my 'jig'. Before any gluing took place I laid Saran wrap over the>>jig, pressed>>it down over the nails so I could use the jig twice.>> Once dry I ran the 1" thick laminated wingtip bow thru my table router>>using a>>1/2" radius round over bit on the outside of the bow to make a nicerounded>>edge.>>The rest was planed down and sanded smooth. It took two trys, two>different>>jigs, to get these bows to line up with the LE, TE, and two spars, butthe>end>>result was worth the effort. Strong as can be too.>>>>Mike C.>>>>>________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Copinfo
Dear Walt: I can't answer your question. I'm new to this too.________________________________________________________________________________
Dear Walt: I can't answer your question. I'm new to this too.________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Fw: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Gary Meadows
Perhaps a confirmation will help others with problems on their wingtip bows. I read Mike Cuy's procedure with great interest because it was step for step how I had made mine and, as with Mike's both bows came out beautifully, were strong as can be and fit perfectly. I am confident that anyone following this method will get a bow they will be happy with.Don ________________________________________________________________________________
Perhaps a confirmation will help others with problems on their wingtip bows. I read Mike Cuy's procedure with great interest because it was step for step how I had made mine and, as with Mike's both bows came out beautifully, were strong as can be and fit perfectly. I am confident that anyone following this method will get a bow they will be happy with.Don ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By:> Michael D Cuy
Just remember Murphy's law. In this case, the stronger the wing tip, theharder you will hit it
.KenOn Fri, 30 Jul 1999, kyle ray wrote:> Has anyone out there in (PAN) Pietenpol Area Network ever> reinforced the outer rib in the event of a ground loop? I was> considering extruding a small piece of aluminum in case the wing> tip hit the run way may be it would act as a skid and prevent damage?> > Russell> > ----- Original Message -----
Just remember Murphy's law. In this case, the stronger the wing tip, theharder you will hit it
.KenOn Fri, 30 Jul 1999, kyle ray wrote:> Has anyone out there in (PAN) Pietenpol Area Network ever> reinforced the outer rib in the event of a ground loop? I was> considering extruding a small piece of aluminum in case the wing> tip hit the run way may be it would act as a skid and prevent damage?> > Russell> > ----- Original Message -----Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: nle97(at)juno.com
Russel,I haven't seen any reinforced wing tips or any installed with scuffplates, but I was called upon to submit an insurance bid to repair adamaged wing tip on a Piet (actually a GN-1) that had groundlooped. Thetip damage was mostly just fabric work, but two ribs about a third of theway from the tip were broken on top from the compression. I didn't getthe job, but there wasn't all that much damage.John Langston__________________________________________________________________________________________
Russel,I haven't seen any reinforced wing tips or any installed with scuffplates, but I was called upon to submit an insurance bid to repair adamaged wing tip on a Piet (actually a GN-1) that had groundlooped. Thetip damage was mostly just fabric work, but two ribs about a third of theway from the tip were broken on top from the compression. I didn't getthe job, but there wasn't all that much damage.John Langston__________________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet wingtip
Original Posted By: Joe & Marian Beck
In a message dated 9/13/99 5:49:53 PM Central Daylight Time, kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca writes:>Build it light and to the plans. Don't forget...wood is quite flexible and has a significant elastic region. Make it stiff and it will snap. Bernie had a feel for what works. You'd be surprized how much flex a wingtip can take in a groundloop. I've seen biplanes groundloop so hard the bottom wing spar flexed as much as 20 degrees and flexed right back in shape with no spar cracking. Ribs usually do take the punishment in a groundloop...but if you go so far as to get a wingtip on a groundloop of a high wing airplane, you'd probably be better off stopping to re-group anyway. Going thru the repair process to patch up a couple of ribs might be just what it takes to sort out what went wrong so as to avoid that situation again. Just a thought. Terry B________________________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 9/13/99 5:49:53 PM Central Daylight Time, kbeanlan(at)spots.ab.ca writes:>Build it light and to the plans. Don't forget...wood is quite flexible and has a significant elastic region. Make it stiff and it will snap. Bernie had a feel for what works. You'd be surprized how much flex a wingtip can take in a groundloop. I've seen biplanes groundloop so hard the bottom wing spar flexed as much as 20 degrees and flexed right back in shape with no spar cracking. Ribs usually do take the punishment in a groundloop...but if you go so far as to get a wingtip on a groundloop of a high wing airplane, you'd probably be better off stopping to re-group anyway. Going thru the repair process to patch up a couple of ribs might be just what it takes to sort out what went wrong so as to avoid that situation again. Just a thought. Terry B________________________________________________________________________________