Original Posted By: "oil can"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Tail assemblyHello to all on the List!Finally I have a reason to come out of my lurking and join thediscussion. As some of you might (with a big capital M, in fact)remember, my father, who helped me through the costruction of myVolksplane VP-1, has recently started a Pietenpol Air Camper on hisown, and I'm keeping him in touch with all other listers since hemisses any knowledge of the English language. So far, he has cut tosize all the material using european white spruce, built the wing ribsand now he's ready to build the tail assembly. And here comes somejustified worrying: both the 1932 Flying and Glider Manual and the 1933plans lack a lot of measurements and make us suspect of a few errorsalso. First, only the stabilator spar dimensions are called out(1"x3/4") but not those of the elevators and rudder. The 1932 plansshow 1"X5/8" in this respect, but the thickness seems too much as it isthe same thickness of the leading edge itself, lending to antrapezoid-shaped elevator rather than a triangle-shaped elevator as itshould be, in our opinion. What sections did you use? Moreover, there'sno measure regarding placement of elevator and rudder horns... anycomment on this also?SeeYa!Andrea VavassoriVolksplane VP-1 I-BYRAFirst Flight July 25th, 1999EAA #348037CAP #1080IHA #52Homepage: http://www.modelberg.comI-BYRA homepage: http://www.modelberg.com/vp.html (under construction)ICQ #15014472snail mail: Via Moroni, 66 I-24122 BERGAMO ITALY________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Tail assembly
> Pietenpol-List: Good News !
Original Posted By: "Warren D. Shoun"
I have contacted Buchanans about spoke wheels until I'm blue in the face !E-mail, letters, and even a letter addressed to the president of the company.I have never received even the politeness of a responce.I mentioned airplane in my first e-mail.Bob>From: Michael D Cuy >Reply-To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Good News !>Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2000 08:54:12 -0400>>>> >> >I agree, Buchanan's just did a set of wire wheels for me and they are >very> >knowledgable about aircraft wheels and not at all afraid to do them.> >> >> >Group- This is GOOD news !! The guy at my local shop was skeptical>of mentioning airplane but it's great to hear there are still companies out>there>who will play ball !>>Mike C.>>________________________________________________________________________________Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 08:56:22 -0700
I have contacted Buchanans about spoke wheels until I'm blue in the face !E-mail, letters, and even a letter addressed to the president of the company.I have never received even the politeness of a responce.I mentioned airplane in my first e-mail.Bob>From: Michael D Cuy >Reply-To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Good News !>Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2000 08:54:12 -0400>>>> >> >I agree, Buchanan's just did a set of wire wheels for me and they are >very> >knowledgable about aircraft wheels and not at all afraid to do them.> >> >> >Group- This is GOOD news !! The guy at my local shop was skeptical>of mentioning airplane but it's great to hear there are still companies out>there>who will play ball !>>Mike C.>>________________________________________________________________________________Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 08:56:22 -0700
Re: Pietenpol-List: Tail assembly
Original Posted By: nle97(at)juno.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Tail assemblyAndrea, We built ours according to the plans; worked out great. The onlyproblem is to remember the different thicknesses and set up a centerline. We did this by makinh a fixture on a piece of plywood and usingshimms to lift the narrower pieces. Once we got this figured out, it waseasy. It's best just to follow the plans; they're really well done. The onlyproblems we've encountered is that the forward fuslage lower cross membercan't go all the way across as it interfers with the engine mount- we'reusing a Model A. Also, there is a top cross member which the plans showgo all the way across between longerons at the top of the forward seat. This will interfer with the aft cabane strut fittings, so we cut it offto make room and added another cross member a little lower. We haven'tglued or bolted our ash engine bearers yet as we haven't bought an engineyet and the figures given in the plans don't add correctly. We need togte an engine so we can measure and see what they are suspossed to be. That's really the only problems we've run into. Just study the planswell before hand.John LangstonPipe Creek, TXnle97(at)juno.com________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Tail assemblyAndrea, We built ours according to the plans; worked out great. The onlyproblem is to remember the different thicknesses and set up a centerline. We did this by makinh a fixture on a piece of plywood and usingshimms to lift the narrower pieces. Once we got this figured out, it waseasy. It's best just to follow the plans; they're really well done. The onlyproblems we've encountered is that the forward fuslage lower cross membercan't go all the way across as it interfers with the engine mount- we'reusing a Model A. Also, there is a top cross member which the plans showgo all the way across between longerons at the top of the forward seat. This will interfer with the aft cabane strut fittings, so we cut it offto make room and added another cross member a little lower. We haven'tglued or bolted our ash engine bearers yet as we haven't bought an engineyet and the figures given in the plans don't add correctly. We need togte an engine so we can measure and see what they are suspossed to be. That's really the only problems we've run into. Just study the planswell before hand.John LangstonPipe Creek, TXnle97(at)juno.com________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Corvair hub on Piet. plans
Original Posted By: "Michael Silvius"
=EF=BB Michael:=C2-Something to chew on for a while and quite educating.=C2-http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/corvai ... C2-Offered not as a discouragement but this should give you an idea of the kind of teritory you are geting in to.=C2-Michael in Maine________________________________________________________________________________
=EF=BB Michael:=C2-Something to chew on for a while and quite educating.=C2-http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/corvai ... C2-Offered not as a discouragement but this should give you an idea of the kind of teritory you are geting in to.=C2-Michael in Maine________________________________________________________________________________
RE: Pietenpol-List: Tail assembly
Original Posted By: KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP
Ken:Try B & B aircraft supply for used turnbucles. I think they are about 1/3 the priceaircraft spruce charges. A couple of years ago when I bought mine I thinkI paid about $8 a complete turnbuckle assemblyHere is the contact info....202 S CenterGardner, KS 66030 (913) 884-5930They are probably at Oshkosh right now, so I am not sure anyone is maning the phones.Rick SchreiberValparaiso, IN----- Original Message -----
Ken:Try B & B aircraft supply for used turnbucles. I think they are about 1/3 the priceaircraft spruce charges. A couple of years ago when I bought mine I thinkI paid about $8 a complete turnbuckle assemblyHere is the contact info....202 S CenterGardner, KS 66030 (913) 884-5930They are probably at Oshkosh right now, so I am not sure anyone is maning the phones.Rick SchreiberValparaiso, IN----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Tail assembly
Original Posted By:
________________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Tail assembly
Original Posted By: Richard Schreiber
I'm using turnbuckles from B&B. Turnbuckles are costly, but what are you going to do. You might try a salvage yard. We have a airplane salvage yard here in Sacramento and I was able to scrounge some turnbuckles there that were cheaper. Chris TracySacramento, CaWebsite at http://www.WestCoastPiet.com ----- Original Message -----
I'm using turnbuckles from B&B. Turnbuckles are costly, but what are you going to do. You might try a salvage yard. We have a airplane salvage yard here in Sacramento and I was able to scrounge some turnbuckles there that were cheaper. Chris TracySacramento, CaWebsite at http://www.WestCoastPiet.com ----- Original Message -----
Pietenpol-List: Tail assembly
Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Re: Pietenpol-List: Tail assembly
Original Posted By: KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP
Ken:A short while ago these these photos were posted to the list. I do not remember who they belong to but I saved them in my goodies file.May be a solution.Michael in Maine ----- Original Message -----
Ken:A short while ago these these photos were posted to the list. I do not remember who they belong to but I saved them in my goodies file.May be a solution.Michael in Maine ----- Original Message -----
RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Corvair hub on Piet. plans
Original Posted By: "KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP"
John,As we all (likely) know, the Air Camper was originally designed around aFord Model A engine, which typically produces 40 HP (with a lot of torque atlow RPMs). Many different engines have been attached to the fronts of AirCampers over the years - some say more different powerplants than any otheraircraft. After WWII, when small Continentals (50 - 65 HP) came on thescene, many people put them on Pietenpols. In 1967, when B.H. Pietenpolreleased the supplemental plans for the Air Camper, he included basicdetails for a lengthened fuselage, for use with the lighter Continental orCorvair engines, as well as motor mounts for both engines. The Corvair thatBHP had used was the earlier 80 HP engine, which likely only producedsomewhere in the range of 60 HP when used on his plane. Builders todayusually use the 95 or 110 HP version of the Corvair, and likely see anactual output of 80 to 100 HP. Over the years, builders have mounted largerengines on their Air Campers, but for the most part, the O-200 (100 HP) isconsidered the upper limit for this aircraft. Some builders who, bynecessity, need more power, due to payload issues (read: body mass) and haveopted for engines larger than the O-200, such as the O-235. This engineproduces more HP, and will impart more stresses onto the airframe. Anyoneconsidering using such a powerplant would be wise to have the airframeanalysed by a qualified person, and reinforced as necessary before strappingthemselves in the seat for takeoff. In the UK, the governing bodiesregarding homebuilt aircraft are much more strict, and restrictive than inthe US. Any change (and they really mean ANY) from the plans must beapproved by the LAA. Following is an excerpt from the LAA Type AcceptanceData Sheet (TADS 047), regarding powerplants to be used on the Air Camper:"The most popular engine for the Air Camper in the UK is the Continental C90or 0-200, without starter or alternator to save weight. The Continental A65has been used but this results in a degraded climb rate and necessitated areduction in allowable maximum gross weight, and hence reduced payload.Lycoming 0-235 engines of 115 and 118 BHP has been used on two examples, butuse of this heavier, more powerful engine necessitates uprating of theforward fuselage and engine mounting attachment fittings."Note that they state that the forward fuselage and engine attachmentfittings must be "uprated".As for explaining about Corvair parts still being manufactured, I think youjust did that.Don't know if this reply helps you or not, but that's my take on thesituation.Bill C.________________________________________________________________________________Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:36:35 -0700 (PDT)
John,As we all (likely) know, the Air Camper was originally designed around aFord Model A engine, which typically produces 40 HP (with a lot of torque atlow RPMs). Many different engines have been attached to the fronts of AirCampers over the years - some say more different powerplants than any otheraircraft. After WWII, when small Continentals (50 - 65 HP) came on thescene, many people put them on Pietenpols. In 1967, when B.H. Pietenpolreleased the supplemental plans for the Air Camper, he included basicdetails for a lengthened fuselage, for use with the lighter Continental orCorvair engines, as well as motor mounts for both engines. The Corvair thatBHP had used was the earlier 80 HP engine, which likely only producedsomewhere in the range of 60 HP when used on his plane. Builders todayusually use the 95 or 110 HP version of the Corvair, and likely see anactual output of 80 to 100 HP. Over the years, builders have mounted largerengines on their Air Campers, but for the most part, the O-200 (100 HP) isconsidered the upper limit for this aircraft. Some builders who, bynecessity, need more power, due to payload issues (read: body mass) and haveopted for engines larger than the O-200, such as the O-235. This engineproduces more HP, and will impart more stresses onto the airframe. Anyoneconsidering using such a powerplant would be wise to have the airframeanalysed by a qualified person, and reinforced as necessary before strappingthemselves in the seat for takeoff. In the UK, the governing bodiesregarding homebuilt aircraft are much more strict, and restrictive than inthe US. Any change (and they really mean ANY) from the plans must beapproved by the LAA. Following is an excerpt from the LAA Type AcceptanceData Sheet (TADS 047), regarding powerplants to be used on the Air Camper:"The most popular engine for the Air Camper in the UK is the Continental C90or 0-200, without starter or alternator to save weight. The Continental A65has been used but this results in a degraded climb rate and necessitated areduction in allowable maximum gross weight, and hence reduced payload.Lycoming 0-235 engines of 115 and 118 BHP has been used on two examples, butuse of this heavier, more powerful engine necessitates uprating of theforward fuselage and engine mounting attachment fittings."Note that they state that the forward fuselage and engine attachmentfittings must be "uprated".As for explaining about Corvair parts still being manufactured, I think youjust did that.Don't know if this reply helps you or not, but that's my take on thesituation.Bill C.________________________________________________________________________________Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 09:36:35 -0700 (PDT)