Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
Hi Gang!Years ago, Mike Cuy started a thread by saying that he had done an end runaround the high cost of using two-part varnishes by applying Minwax Helmsmanurethane varnish to his structure. Mike then applied a light coat of Dupont222S sanding sealer over that and waited two months for the stuff to curebefore covering. He said that the combination of products and the cure timeprovided resistance to the MEK used in the covering materials. Great! Savea zillion dollars! I'm for that! Later in the same thread someone askedMike if the Dupont 222S step was necessary. He said that he didn't knowbecause he hadn't tried it that way. So, therein lies my question. Hasanybody experimented with using Minwax Helmsman urethane varnish (orsimilar) by itself and let it cure for months before covering? Did itresist the MEK? What was your process? What's the current knowledge inthis subject?Does anyone know if POR-15 Blackcote will resist MEK after it has had monthsto cure?Larry Prange - Getting ready to cover, in the rain, on the Olympic Peninsula.. . .NX1929A________________________________________________________________________________Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 15:05:50 -0500
Pietenpol-List: Varnishing Alternatives
Re: Pietenpol-List: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
Re: Pietenpol-List: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: "Prange Larry J PSNS"
I have used clear, satin Minwax Poluurethane varnish exclusively on the fuseand wing with the Stitts process and have experienced no difficulty withlifting...My $.02..Carl Vought----- Original Message -----
I have used clear, satin Minwax Poluurethane varnish exclusively on the fuseand wing with the Stitts process and have experienced no difficulty withlifting...My $.02..Carl Vought----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: "Jack Phillips"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Varnishing AlternativesI used Ace Spar Varnish Gloss (pt #16375) for everything, including the prop. No problem with the covering material lifting the varnish.Chuck G.________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Varnishing AlternativesI used Ace Spar Varnish Gloss (pt #16375) for everything, including the prop. No problem with the covering material lifting the varnish.Chuck G.________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
Hey Carl!Did you use 'Minwax Helmsman Urethane Varnish' (in the green can, cleans upwith paint thinner) or did you use 'Minwax Polyurethane Varnish' (in theblue can, cleans up with water)?Thanks,Larry Prange - Still think'n about it.NX1929AI have used clear, satin Minwax Poluurethane varnish exclusively on the fuseand wing with the Stitts process and have experienced no difficulty withlifting...My $.02..Carl Vought________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 16:44:43 -0500
Hey Carl!Did you use 'Minwax Helmsman Urethane Varnish' (in the green can, cleans upwith paint thinner) or did you use 'Minwax Polyurethane Varnish' (in theblue can, cleans up with water)?Thanks,Larry Prange - Still think'n about it.NX1929AI have used clear, satin Minwax Poluurethane varnish exclusively on the fuseand wing with the Stitts process and have experienced no difficulty withlifting...My $.02..Carl Vought________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 16:44:43 -0500
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: "Prange Larry J PSNS"
The "Helmsman" part doesn't show up on the can. It thins and cleans up withmineral sperits..no water involved and the can is golden colored. Otherwise,the product nomenclature is as shown in my previous email....goodluck.....Carl----- Original Message -----
The "Helmsman" part doesn't show up on the can. It thins and cleans up withmineral sperits..no water involved and the can is golden colored. Otherwise,the product nomenclature is as shown in my previous email....goodluck.....Carl----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa
Original Posted By: "Michael D Cuy"
wow... look how long that engine mount is!I wonder how it performsDJ----- Original Message -----
wow... look how long that engine mount is!I wonder how it performsDJ----- Original Message -----
Pietenpol-List: A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa
Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gave one coat of HelmsmanClear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor Spar Urethane (in the green can, cleansup with paint thinner).....I probably coated that rib sometime early last year...it's been there for awhile....No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....no nuttin.....Looks fine to me.....Jim Markle Senior Sales EngineerArt Technology Group - ATG:jim(at)atg.com*+1.469.371.0669'+1.972.447.8330 -----Original Message-----
I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gave one coat of HelmsmanClear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor Spar Urethane (in the green can, cleansup with paint thinner).....I probably coated that rib sometime early last year...it's been there for awhile....No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....no nuttin.....Looks fine to me.....Jim Markle Senior Sales EngineerArt Technology Group - ATG:jim(at)atg.com*+1.469.371.0669'+1.972.447.8330 -----Original Message-----
RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: N321TX(at)wmconnect.com
My question is, if you varnish the ribs before mounting on the spar, will the gluehold the rib to the spar on a varnished rib?AlexS-------------- Original message -------------- > > I did a little testing on that stuff and had the same result. Just make > sure you specify the one below. > > Clif > > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives > > > > > > I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gave one coat of Helmsman > > Clear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor Spar Urethane (in the green can, > cleans > > up with paint thinner)..... > > > > I probably coated that rib sometime early last year...it's been there for > a > > while.... > > > > No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....no nuttin..... > > > > Looks fine to me..... > > > > Jim Markle > > > > > > > > > > My question is, if you varnish the ribs before mounting on the spar, willthe glue hold the rib to the spar on a varnished rib?AlexS-------------- Original message -------------- -- Pietenpol-Listmessage posted by: Clif Dawson I did a little testing on that stuff and had the same result. Just make sure you specify the one below. Clif Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gaveone coat of Helmsman Clear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor SparUrethane (in the green can, cleans up with paint thinner)..... I probably coated that rib sometime earlylast year...it's been there for a while.... No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....nonuttin..... Looks fine t________________________________________________________________________________
My question is, if you varnish the ribs before mounting on the spar, will the gluehold the rib to the spar on a varnished rib?AlexS-------------- Original message -------------- > > I did a little testing on that stuff and had the same result. Just make > sure you specify the one below. > > Clif > > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives > > > > > > I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gave one coat of Helmsman > > Clear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor Spar Urethane (in the green can, > cleans > > up with paint thinner)..... > > > > I probably coated that rib sometime early last year...it's been there for > a > > while.... > > > > No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....no nuttin..... > > > > Looks fine to me..... > > > > Jim Markle > > > > > > > > > > My question is, if you varnish the ribs before mounting on the spar, willthe glue hold the rib to the spar on a varnished rib?AlexS-------------- Original message -------------- -- Pietenpol-Listmessage posted by: Clif Dawson I did a little testing on that stuff and had the same result. Just make sure you specify the one below. Clif Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives I just rubbed an MEK soaked rag on a rib that I gaveone coat of Helmsman Clear Gloss oil based indoor/outdoor SparUrethane (in the green can, cleans up with paint thinner)..... I probably coated that rib sometime earlylast year...it's been there for a while.... No problem.....no lifting.....no sticky.....no gooey.....nonuttin..... Looks fine t________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: alexms1(at)comcast.net
THAT I'm not going to test.
I only have a couple varnished ribs on the sparsince I realized after I varnished a couple that the bonding areas HAD to bebare (dust free) wood to bare wood....in other words....varnish AFTER mountingor protect the areas where an adhesive will need "teeth"...... ----- Original Message -----
THAT I'm not going to test.
I only have a couple varnished ribs on the sparsince I realized after I varnished a couple that the bonding areas HAD to bebare (dust free) wood to bare wood....in other words....varnish AFTER mountingor protect the areas where an adhesive will need "teeth"...... ----- Original Message -----Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: Rcaprd(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing AlternativesIn a message dated 11/29/04 11:04:18 PM Central Standard Time, alexms1(at)comcast.net writes:>The adhesive (T88 or whatever) WILL NOT hold the rib to the spar, if it has already been varnished. Varnish only after ALL the construction of the wing is totally complete, including the entire aileron portions.Chuck G.________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing AlternativesIn a message dated 11/29/04 11:04:18 PM Central Standard Time, alexms1(at)comcast.net writes:>The adhesive (T88 or whatever) WILL NOT hold the rib to the spar, if it has already been varnished. Varnish only after ALL the construction of the wing is totally complete, including the entire aileron portions.Chuck G.________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: Ed Smith
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing AlternativesIn a message dated 11/30/04 7:48:19 AM Central Standard Time, farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com writes:>There have been many early aircraft built this way, but with all the flexing, and twisting the wing sees in service, the nails must work loose, and it was before contemporary adhesives were developed. I believe T88 is far superior to nailing the ribs to the spars.Chuck G.________________________________________________________________________________Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 10:33:26 -0500
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing AlternativesIn a message dated 11/30/04 7:48:19 AM Central Standard Time, farmerdel(at)rocketmail.com writes:>There have been many early aircraft built this way, but with all the flexing, and twisting the wing sees in service, the nails must work loose, and it was before contemporary adhesives were developed. I believe T88 is far superior to nailing the ribs to the spars.Chuck G.________________________________________________________________________________Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 10:33:26 -0500
Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By: Michael D Cuy
Thanks to all who weighed in on my varnishing question! Is this a greatlist or what?AlexS,Epoxy glues will produce a better bond to bare wood than to any slicksurface, like varnish. If you want two pieces of wood to stick together,there should be nothing but glue in between them.**********AlexS Wrote:My question is, if you varnish the ribs before mounting on the spar, willthe glue hold the rib to the spar on a varnished rib?Larry Prange - Slap'n on the Helmsman in the rain . . .NX1929A________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 18:06:02 -0500
Thanks to all who weighed in on my varnishing question! Is this a greatlist or what?AlexS,Epoxy glues will produce a better bond to bare wood than to any slicksurface, like varnish. If you want two pieces of wood to stick together,there should be nothing but glue in between them.**********AlexS Wrote:My question is, if you varnish the ribs before mounting on the spar, willthe glue hold the rib to the spar on a varnished rib?Larry Prange - Slap'n on the Helmsman in the rain . . .NX1929A________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 18:06:02 -0500
> Pietenpol-List: A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa
Original Posted By: BARNSTMR(at)aol.com
Re: Pietenpol-List: A VW powered Piet ~in South Africa
Original Posted By:
yeah I think your right. looks like a two holerDJ----- Original Message -----
yeah I think your right. looks like a two holerDJ----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Varnishing Alternatives
Original Posted By:> > alexms1(at)comcast.net
Del,Why would you NOT want to glue the ribs to the spars?Alex S.-------------- Original message -------------- > > This is only a suggestion, you can mask the area where > you wish to glue and varnish the rest. I have done > this on other parts of the wood work. > > Doc > --- del magsam wrote: > > > The spars don't need to be bonded to the spar with > > adhesive. Toe nailed top and bottom is more than > > good. Many piets are flying with charlies ribs and > > this is his reccomendation. > > Del > > > > Jim Markle wrote: > > THAT I'm not going to test. I only have a > > couple varnished ribs on the spar since I realized > > after I varnished a couple that the bonding areas > > HAD to be bare (dust free) wood to bare wood....in > > other words....varnish AFTER mounting or protect the > > areas where an adhesive will need "teeth"...... > > ----- Original Message -----
Del,Why would you NOT want to glue the ribs to the spars?Alex S.-------------- Original message -------------- > > This is only a suggestion, you can mask the area where > you wish to glue and varnish the rest. I have done > this on other parts of the wood work. > > Doc > --- del magsam wrote: > > > The spars don't need to be bonded to the spar with > > adhesive. Toe nailed top and bottom is more than > > good. Many piets are flying with charlies ribs and > > this is his reccomendation. > > Del > > > > Jim Markle wrote: > > THAT I'm not going to test.
I only have a > > couple varnished ribs on the spar since I realized > > after I varnished a couple that the bonding areas > > HAD to be bare (dust free) wood to bare wood....in > > other words....varnish AFTER mounting or protect the > > areas where an adhesive will need "teeth"...... > > ----- Original Message -----