Original Posted By: RAMPEYBOY(at)aol.com
Hello all:This may be a rather long post asking for advice on engines. Please bear with me.I answered an ad for a homebuilt project with an engine, mainly to find out about the possibility of using an aircraft engine instead of the Corvair I intend to convert. I was at my father's apartment when I made the call since the location of the project was not too far from his location. (my dad is 92 now and was a flight instructor right after the war). I had repeated the fellow's name as I wrote it down. After the conversation, my father said he thought he knew that name. I drove over to this fellow's home and asked if he ever knew a Carl Butsch. He said, "Well heck yes I know Carl. We grew up next door to each other not a block from here! Used to build model airplanes together back in the late twenties and early thirties"!! Needles to say, we had a great conversation for about three hours.Now to the meat of this novella. Turns out that I was not really interested in his project,... but he mentioned he had a 65 H.P. Lycoming that he had removed from the homebuilt when he bought it in flying condition. (don't know how long ago). He showed it to me and it is complete and has a motor mount and prop (70 X 30 it looks like). Also, he has two others like it for parts and a fourth which has been disassembled. He has the engine logs and says he pickled it. (we'll see about that statement). He has the engine logs which I have not read yet, but he says it had 570 hours when it was taken off of the flying homebuilt. He wants $3,000 for the package. It is remotely possible to get two useable engines from the whole if one gets lucky. Next situation. He also had a Continental A-75 sitting there which I asked about. He said it came out of a friends Aeronca for a larger engine upgrade. He has the logs for that one as well, and says it has 357 hours on it. Also pickled, he says. However he has no carb on it. He traded it for a couple of rebuilt mags for the Lycoming. No prop or motor mount with it. He wants $2,500 for that one. He also had a complete A-65 from an aircraft but no logs, as well as another A-65 off of an air boat which was running when he went to purchase it. Also, no logs with that one. I can't even take the time or space to list all the other stuff he showed me he is going to be selling! He is 86 years young and is loosing his sight but still seems to have the energy of a 50 year old man.Another couple of side comments before I get to some specific questions. The fellow was thrilled to happen across his old boyhood friend's son and I don't think he would sell me down the river just to get rid of these engines or parts. (but one never knows). I mentioned that I had a nasty looking core Corvair engine I intended to convert and had paid too much for it. He said, "Come out here, I want to show you something". In one of his sheds, he uncovered a complete Corvair engine he had taken out of the car and it was running at the time. He said it is one of the late model engines from a Monza, 110 hp, two carb set-up. Then he said, "Come back with a trailer and we'll load it up. You can HAVE IT" !!! I said, "Well, let me thin...O.K."!!I have read, again, Tony's advice on buying used aircraft engines and will take back my little light I made for illuminating the cylinder interiors and my little chip of an inspection mirror to have a look inside. I think I would prefer having the A-75 for a bit more H.P. but would still have to buy a carb and prop. I'll make a better judgment call after going back to inspect ,and hearing everyone's comments and advice.Now, questions:What is the designation for a 65 H.P. Lycoming? I can't remember the number the fellow gave me and in Tony's book he only gives designations back to the 108 H.P.Lycoming.Given the two options I'm considering, (Continental A-75 with logs, no carb, no engine mount, and no prop,......or the Lycoming 65 H.P. with Logs, the prop, and three other engines for possible parts and two motor mounts (for test stand use only) ), What would you guys do, given the prices for each situation I mentioned?What about fuel type if one of these is still useable after cleaning up? Both were meant to use low octane leaded fuel. Use 100 LL instead (what about possible detonation?), or auto unleaded fuel? What does one do in this situation?The Sensenich prop with the Lycoming package, (I believe it is stamped 70 X 30) is in excellent condition. Would this prop work very well on the Lycoming on the Air Camper?O.K, O.K., I'll stop now and wait for advice. Thanks for reading my novella!Bob Butsch in Indy. ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Need engine info
Re: Pietenpol-List: Need engine info
Original Posted By: John Hofmann
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Need engine infoBob, I believe the 65 hp Lyc to be an O-145? Maybe, maybe not..**************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Need engine infoBob, I believe the 65 hp Lyc to be an O-145? Maybe, maybe not..**************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Need engine info
Original Posted By: RBush96589(at)aol.com
Hi Bob,The Lycoming is an O-145. They are pretty neat engines and 3K for the lot may be a bit on the high side but not too bad. They are hard to find parts for (I know, I have one) but are really smooth running. They are built different from a Continental with the cylinders and crankcase cast as one component and coverplates instead of a split case. However, I would probably not put one on a Pietenpol. Their 65 horses is not the same as an A-65 (or A-75). 145 cubic inches vs. 179(?) cubic inches. The O-145 is probably too light as well. I would make for a pretty long engine mount. The A-75 would be my choice of the two. I am burning 100LL now with mine in a Cub and it runs well. I do think I should pull my plugs and have a look soon, just to ease my mind. I do have the auto fuel STC and my airport has 93 octane for sale at the pumps.-john-John HofmannVice-President, Information TechnologyThe Rees Group, Inc.2810 Crossroads Drive, Ste 3800Madison, WI 53718Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150Fax: 608.443.2474Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.comOn Jun 23, 2008, at 11:53 AM, Robert Butsch wrote:> Hello all:>> This may be a rather long post asking for advice on engines. Please > bear with me.> I answered an ad for a homebuilt project with an engine, mainly to > find out about the possibility of using an aircraft engine instead > of the Corvair I intend to convert. I was at my father's apartment > when I made the call since the location of the project was not too > far from his location. (my dad is 92 now and was a flight > instructor right after the war). I had repeated the fellow's name > as I wrote it down. After the conversation, my father said he > thought he knew that name. I drove over to this fellow's home and > asked if he ever knew a Carl Butsch. He said, "Well heck yes I know > Carl. We grew up next door to each other not a block from here! > Used to build model airplanes together back in the late twenties and > early thirties"!! Needles to say, we had a great conversation for > about three hours.>> Now to the meat of this novella. Turns out that I was not really > interested in his project,... but he mentioned he had a 65 H.P. > Lycoming that he had removed from the homebuilt when he bought it in > flying condition. (don't know how long ago). He showed it to me > and it is complete and has a motor mount and prop (70 X 30 it looks > like). Also, he has two others like it for parts and a fourth which > has been disassembled. He has the engine logs and says he pickled > it. (we'll see about that statement). He has the engine logs which > I have not read yet, but he says it had 570 hours when it was taken > off of the flying homebuilt. He wants $3,000 for the package. It > is remotely possible to get two useable engines from the whole if > one gets lucky.>> Next situation. He also had a Continental A-75 sitting there which > I asked about. He said it came out of a friends Aeronca for a > larger engine upgrade. He has the logs for that one as well, and > says it has 357 hours on it. Also pickled, he says. However he has > no carb on it. He traded it for a couple of rebuilt mags for the > Lycoming. No prop or motor mount with it. He wants $2,500 for that > one.>> He also had a complete A-65 from an aircraft but no logs, as well as > another A-65 off of an air boat which was running when he went to > purchase it. Also, no logs with that one. I can't even take the > time or space to list all the other stuff he showed me he is going > to be selling! He is 86 years young and is loosing his sight but > still seems to have the energy of a 50 year old man.>> Another couple of side comments before I get to some specific > questions. The fellow was thrilled to happen across his old boyhood > friend's son and I don't think he would sell me down the river just > to get rid of these engines or parts. (but one never knows). I > mentioned that I had a nasty looking core Corvair engine I intended > to convert and had paid too much for it. He said, "Come out here, I > want to show you something". In one of his sheds, he uncovered a > complete Corvair engine he had taken out of the car and it was > running at the time. He said it is one of the late model engines > from a Monza, 110 hp, two carb set-up. Then he said, "Come back > with a trailer and we'll load it up. You can HAVE IT" !!! I said, > "Well, let me thin...O.K."!!>> I have read, again, Tony's advice on buying used aircraft engines > and will take back my little light I made for illuminating the > cylinder interiors and my little chip of an inspection mirror to > have a look inside. I think I would prefer having the A-75 for a > bit more H.P. but would still have to buy a carb and prop. I'll > make a better judgment call after going back to inspect ,and hearing > everyone's comments and advice.>> Now, questions:> What is the designation for a 65 H.P. Lycoming? I can't remember > the number the fellow gave me and in Tony's book he only gives > designations back to the 108 H.P.Lycoming.>> Given the two options I'm considering, (Continental A-75 with logs, > no carb, no engine mount, and no prop,......or the Lycoming 65 H.P. > with Logs, the prop, and three other engines for possible parts and > two motor mounts (for test stand use only) ), What would you guys > do, given the prices for each situation I mentioned?>> What about fuel type if one of these is still useable after cleaning > up? Both were meant to use low octane leaded fuel. Use 100 LL > instead (what about possible detonation?), or auto unleaded fuel? > What does one do in this situation?>> The Sensenich prop with the Lycoming package, (I believe it is > stamped 70 X 30) is in excellent condition. Would this prop work > very well on the Lycoming on the Air Camper?>> O.K, O.K., I'll stop now and wait for advice. Thanks for reading my > novella!>> Bob Butsch in Indy.>>________________________________________________________________________________
Hi Bob,The Lycoming is an O-145. They are pretty neat engines and 3K for the lot may be a bit on the high side but not too bad. They are hard to find parts for (I know, I have one) but are really smooth running. They are built different from a Continental with the cylinders and crankcase cast as one component and coverplates instead of a split case. However, I would probably not put one on a Pietenpol. Their 65 horses is not the same as an A-65 (or A-75). 145 cubic inches vs. 179(?) cubic inches. The O-145 is probably too light as well. I would make for a pretty long engine mount. The A-75 would be my choice of the two. I am burning 100LL now with mine in a Cub and it runs well. I do think I should pull my plugs and have a look soon, just to ease my mind. I do have the auto fuel STC and my airport has 93 octane for sale at the pumps.-john-John HofmannVice-President, Information TechnologyThe Rees Group, Inc.2810 Crossroads Drive, Ste 3800Madison, WI 53718Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150Fax: 608.443.2474Email: jhofmann(at)reesgroupinc.comOn Jun 23, 2008, at 11:53 AM, Robert Butsch wrote:> Hello all:>> This may be a rather long post asking for advice on engines. Please > bear with me.> I answered an ad for a homebuilt project with an engine, mainly to > find out about the possibility of using an aircraft engine instead > of the Corvair I intend to convert. I was at my father's apartment > when I made the call since the location of the project was not too > far from his location. (my dad is 92 now and was a flight > instructor right after the war). I had repeated the fellow's name > as I wrote it down. After the conversation, my father said he > thought he knew that name. I drove over to this fellow's home and > asked if he ever knew a Carl Butsch. He said, "Well heck yes I know > Carl. We grew up next door to each other not a block from here! > Used to build model airplanes together back in the late twenties and > early thirties"!! Needles to say, we had a great conversation for > about three hours.>> Now to the meat of this novella. Turns out that I was not really > interested in his project,... but he mentioned he had a 65 H.P. > Lycoming that he had removed from the homebuilt when he bought it in > flying condition. (don't know how long ago). He showed it to me > and it is complete and has a motor mount and prop (70 X 30 it looks > like). Also, he has two others like it for parts and a fourth which > has been disassembled. He has the engine logs and says he pickled > it. (we'll see about that statement). He has the engine logs which > I have not read yet, but he says it had 570 hours when it was taken > off of the flying homebuilt. He wants $3,000 for the package. It > is remotely possible to get two useable engines from the whole if > one gets lucky.>> Next situation. He also had a Continental A-75 sitting there which > I asked about. He said it came out of a friends Aeronca for a > larger engine upgrade. He has the logs for that one as well, and > says it has 357 hours on it. Also pickled, he says. However he has > no carb on it. He traded it for a couple of rebuilt mags for the > Lycoming. No prop or motor mount with it. He wants $2,500 for that > one.>> He also had a complete A-65 from an aircraft but no logs, as well as > another A-65 off of an air boat which was running when he went to > purchase it. Also, no logs with that one. I can't even take the > time or space to list all the other stuff he showed me he is going > to be selling! He is 86 years young and is loosing his sight but > still seems to have the energy of a 50 year old man.>> Another couple of side comments before I get to some specific > questions. The fellow was thrilled to happen across his old boyhood > friend's son and I don't think he would sell me down the river just > to get rid of these engines or parts. (but one never knows). I > mentioned that I had a nasty looking core Corvair engine I intended > to convert and had paid too much for it. He said, "Come out here, I > want to show you something". In one of his sheds, he uncovered a > complete Corvair engine he had taken out of the car and it was > running at the time. He said it is one of the late model engines > from a Monza, 110 hp, two carb set-up. Then he said, "Come back > with a trailer and we'll load it up. You can HAVE IT" !!! I said, > "Well, let me thin...O.K."!!>> I have read, again, Tony's advice on buying used aircraft engines > and will take back my little light I made for illuminating the > cylinder interiors and my little chip of an inspection mirror to > have a look inside. I think I would prefer having the A-75 for a > bit more H.P. but would still have to buy a carb and prop. I'll > make a better judgment call after going back to inspect ,and hearing > everyone's comments and advice.>> Now, questions:> What is the designation for a 65 H.P. Lycoming? I can't remember > the number the fellow gave me and in Tony's book he only gives > designations back to the 108 H.P.Lycoming.>> Given the two options I'm considering, (Continental A-75 with logs, > no carb, no engine mount, and no prop,......or the Lycoming 65 H.P. > with Logs, the prop, and three other engines for possible parts and > two motor mounts (for test stand use only) ), What would you guys > do, given the prices for each situation I mentioned?>> What about fuel type if one of these is still useable after cleaning > up? Both were meant to use low octane leaded fuel. Use 100 LL > instead (what about possible detonation?), or auto unleaded fuel? > What does one do in this situation?>> The Sensenich prop with the Lycoming package, (I believe it is > stamped 70 X 30) is in excellent condition. Would this prop work > very well on the Lycoming on the Air Camper?>> O.K, O.K., I'll stop now and wait for advice. Thanks for reading my > novella!>> Bob Butsch in Indy.>>________________________________________________________________________________