Original Posted By: Ryan Mueller
Good clarifications, Ryan.Thanks for making that more clear.In any case it seems pretty clear that the pilot needs to keep both hands-occupied with things other than brakes, whether in the air or on the ground.-Bill C.-________________________________________________________________________________Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 09:49:52 -0600Subject: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Pietenpol-List: Hand Brake Pictures
Original Posted By: Oscar Zuniga
Don=3B looks like you cut your aileron cables a bit short=2C eh?Oscar ZunigaAir Camper NX41CCSan Antonio=2C TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net________________________________________________________________________________
Don=3B looks like you cut your aileron cables a bit short=2C eh?Oscar ZunigaAir Camper NX41CCSan Antonio=2C TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Original Posted By: Rick Holland
It is not correct that pinked tape is "typically" biased tape. Virtually all tape is pinked. The pinking keeps the edge from fraying. In the very early times, such as WWI, tapes were often just frayed on purpose for a few threads to keep them from unravelling further. Straight edged tapes are the exception, mostly when synthetics came about, and only because they were cheaper.Biased tape is a whole different thing. Biased tape can make curves as stated. Again, usually pinked but I suppose there may be straight edged bias tape as well.Gene________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 07:58:08 -0700Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
It is not correct that pinked tape is "typically" biased tape. Virtually all tape is pinked. The pinking keeps the edge from fraying. In the very early times, such as WWI, tapes were often just frayed on purpose for a few threads to keep them from unravelling further. Straight edged tapes are the exception, mostly when synthetics came about, and only because they were cheaper.Biased tape is a whole different thing. Biased tape can make curves as stated. Again, usually pinked but I suppose there may be straight edged bias tape as well.Gene________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 07:58:08 -0700Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight does matter but cosmentics of latex ?
Original Posted By: amsafetyc(at)aol.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Weight does matter but cosmentics of latex ?Forgive the intrusion good people, (fans of TGWP will recognize that line) but if I might interject a personalopinion about latex finishes: they look like crap.Please allow me to further express my sentiments that I am a staunch supporter of those who use latex paint or any othermethod to finish the fabric on their airplane or many simple reasons----if you took the time to saw up wood, make metal fittingsfrom raw sheet and tube 4130 material, learned how to weld and rib stitch, if you have burned your fingers on recently-groundfittings, if you've had T-88 in places where you didn't even know you had places, if you've coughed all night long from inhaling wooddust particles from sanding, if you've had to decide to wait until next month or next payday to buy turnbuckles because your kidstuition was due or you had some dental bills to pay or you just took on a car payment, if you've thought seriously about giving upyour project completely and just selling it on ebay, and if you've done all these things to build your very own Pietenpol then I sayyou can put whatever the heck you please on your airplane to finish the fabric. You can use whatever engine you want, Model A,Corvair, Subaru, Continental, Evinrude, wood landing gear, steel gear, Cub tires, motorcycle wheels, long fuselage, short fuselage,nose fuel, wing fuel, both nose and wing fuel, wider center section, a center section with a flop or a center section with a cutout,a clipped wing Pietenpol, or even (and some will gasp at this one) build a Grega GN-1 then you have every right to make every decisionabout the options you chose for your airplane. When people come up to me and say "well why didn't you......" my general responseis "well when YOU build your Pietenpol.....YOU can incorporate that into your airplane" but I chose to 'do it this way'.Mike C. in OhioPS-- there are some latex finished airplanes out there that really don't look bad....Shad and Gary Bell's a very nice example of a latex-paintedPiet and I had to look twice up close before I realized it...so it can be done, it can save lots of money (which is very admirable if safety is not compromised)and it can look okay !________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight does matter but cosmentics of latex ?
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Weight does matter but cosmentics of latex ?Forgive the intrusion good people, (fans of TGWP will recognize that line) but if I might interject a personalopinion about latex finishes: they look like crap.Please allow me to further express my sentiments that I am a staunch supporter of those who use latex paint or any othermethod to finish the fabric on their airplane or many simple reasons----if you took the time to saw up wood, make metal fittingsfrom raw sheet and tube 4130 material, learned how to weld and rib stitch, if you have burned your fingers on recently-groundfittings, if you've had T-88 in places where you didn't even know you had places, if you've coughed all night long from inhaling wooddust particles from sanding, if you've had to decide to wait until next month or next payday to buy turnbuckles because your kidstuition was due or you had some dental bills to pay or you just took on a car payment, if you've thought seriously about giving upyour project completely and just selling it on ebay, and if you've done all these things to build your very own Pietenpol then I sayyou can put whatever the heck you please on your airplane to finish the fabric. You can use whatever engine you want, Model A,Corvair, Subaru, Continental, Evinrude, wood landing gear, steel gear, Cub tires, motorcycle wheels, long fuselage, short fuselage,nose fuel, wing fuel, both nose and wing fuel, wider center section, a center section with a flop or a center section with a cutout,a clipped wing Pietenpol, or even (and some will gasp at this one) build a Grega GN-1 then you have every right to make every decisionabout the options you chose for your airplane. When people come up to me and say "well why didn't you......" my general responseis "well when YOU build your Pietenpol.....YOU can incorporate that into your airplane" but I chose to 'do it this way'.Mike C. in OhioPS-- there are some latex finished airplanes out there that really don't look bad....Shad and Gary Bell's a very nice example of a latex-paintedPiet and I had to look twice up close before I realized it...so it can be done, it can save lots of money (which is very admirable if safety is not compromised)and it can look okay !________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight does matter but cosmentics of latex ?
Original Posted By: "Gary Boothe"
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RE: Pietenpol-List: Weight does matter but cosmentics of latex ?
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Mike,You certainly covered the gamut, although I notice you left out wood strutsand home-made turnbuckles.I am not a tree-hugger. In fact, Lord knows the trees on my property shudderwhen they see me emerge from my shed with my chainsaw and goalie mask! And Iactually spent the night in the hospital from breathing too many paint fumeswhile working on my Aeronca Sedan. But the building industry, of which I ama part, is becoming fully immersed in Green. Architects are commanded tolook for green solutions, and many manufacturers have responded. Just theother night I attended a presentation by Benjamin Moore that focused on thisaspect. It was interesting to note that, not only are they solving the VOCissues, but the paints they are now offering are a huge improvement,performance-wise. This is not an endorsement of BM, as I am sure all the major manufacturershave comparable products, but among those improvements are: Greaterflexibility, and much greater UV resistance! Both highly desirable for us.The low and zero VOC paints force the manufacturers to look at new solutionsto old problems, including how the pigments interact with resins in thepaint. Plus, most of these paints are considered 'high build'. That's 3points for us.what's the down side?In his opinion Mike noted so delicately that Latex ".looks like crap." I amcurious, from those on this List that know WAY more about paint than I, whatinput you may have on the quality of low and zero VOC vs. common latex.Gary BootheCool, Ca.PietenpolWW Corvair ConversionTail done, working on fuselage (endless metal parts!)(12 ribs down.) _____
Mike,You certainly covered the gamut, although I notice you left out wood strutsand home-made turnbuckles.I am not a tree-hugger. In fact, Lord knows the trees on my property shudderwhen they see me emerge from my shed with my chainsaw and goalie mask! And Iactually spent the night in the hospital from breathing too many paint fumeswhile working on my Aeronca Sedan. But the building industry, of which I ama part, is becoming fully immersed in Green. Architects are commanded tolook for green solutions, and many manufacturers have responded. Just theother night I attended a presentation by Benjamin Moore that focused on thisaspect. It was interesting to note that, not only are they solving the VOCissues, but the paints they are now offering are a huge improvement,performance-wise. This is not an endorsement of BM, as I am sure all the major manufacturershave comparable products, but among those improvements are: Greaterflexibility, and much greater UV resistance! Both highly desirable for us.The low and zero VOC paints force the manufacturers to look at new solutionsto old problems, including how the pigments interact with resins in thepaint. Plus, most of these paints are considered 'high build'. That's 3points for us.what's the down side?In his opinion Mike noted so delicately that Latex ".looks like crap." I amcurious, from those on this List that know WAY more about paint than I, whatinput you may have on the quality of low and zero VOC vs. common latex.Gary BootheCool, Ca.PietenpolWW Corvair ConversionTail done, working on fuselage (endless metal parts!)(12 ribs down.) _____
Pietenpol-List: Weight does matter but cosmentics of latex ?
Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight does matter but cosmentics of latex ?
Original Posted By: H RULE
Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Original Posted By: Ryan Mueller
The flight attendants kept the passengers from opening the doors, not on direction from the front, but their own knowledge and training. There is no switch to prevent it. The only real difference between his landing and a normal landing, technique-wise, was to close the "ditch switch," which he did not do.Gene________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 17:39:20 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
The flight attendants kept the passengers from opening the doors, not on direction from the front, but their own knowledge and training. There is no switch to prevent it. The only real difference between his landing and a normal landing, technique-wise, was to close the "ditch switch," which he did not do.Gene________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 17:39:20 -0600Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Original Posted By: Rick Holland
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Original Posted By: Ryan Mueller
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Original Posted By: Rick Holland
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight does matter but cosmentics of latex?Just a few notes on poly finishes. I just completed wings and fuselage of my ultralite---all in the poly system. If you put on enough poly brush as recommended in the manual you will not see the weave in the fabric. As I progressed in the learning curve, I applied more vinyl in the poly brush coatsfor a smoother appearance.. I started with tail surfaces and did wings next then fuselage. My fuselage is the smoothest. The tail surfaces show the mostweave. Just a matter of learning how to spray "wet" and avoid runs. I don'tknow why y'all are trying to save money with non aero finishes. Seems more risky and waste of time to avoid aero systems that really work. Just my opinion as a first time builder. have at it!In a message dated 2/15/2009 9:03:55 P.M. Central Standard Time, taildrags(at)hotmail.com writes:Mikee-Since you are the builder of an award-winning Piet with agorgeous paint job, I accept your comments as extremelyvaluable. But if I may, I'd like to offer my observations onthe latex paint that I just applied side-by-side withPoly-Tone.1. Flexibility is NOT an issue! Fabric finished with latex isalmost TOO limp compared to conventional solvent-basedfinishes. I would be very, very surprised if latex paint evercracked on a fabric airplane, even directly in the drummingof a propwash area.2. When applied in full, thick coats latex seems quite proneto runs. Especially when applied using flow-out agents, Iwould be very surprised if a decent paint job could be laiddown on anything but a perfectly horizontal surface. BUT-I am NOT a painter! I just know that the paint needs togo down pretty heavily to block UV, and that makes itsusceptible to runs because it doesn't dry particularlyfast, compared with Poly-Tone.3. Standard Poly-Tone, when dry, appears to be closer toa flat paint finish than a satin or semi-gloss. I don't knowif you or others have added other finishes over the standardcolor coat to give it gloss or sheen, but the Poly-Tone I'veused is smooth but certainly not shiny. In that respect itmakes a fabric airplane look like a fabric airplane, but not ashiny one. Latex, on the other hand, gives a very smoothand satiny finish and there is no sign of the weave.4. I can't say anything about the crispness of maskededges with either finish since I haven't done that yet, butperhaps this is one area that you have a beef with? Whatparts of latex paint jobs that you've seen made you thinkthey looked lousy?I'm not defending either side here, just trying to learn.And you'll note from pictures of me that my ears are alwaysfully extended in listening mode ;o)Oscar ZunigaAir Camper NX41CCSan Antonio, TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List) (http://www.matronics.com/contribution) **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! bemailfooterNO62)________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:02:11 -0700Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight does matter but cosmentics of latex?Just a few notes on poly finishes. I just completed wings and fuselage of my ultralite---all in the poly system. If you put on enough poly brush as recommended in the manual you will not see the weave in the fabric. As I progressed in the learning curve, I applied more vinyl in the poly brush coatsfor a smoother appearance.. I started with tail surfaces and did wings next then fuselage. My fuselage is the smoothest. The tail surfaces show the mostweave. Just a matter of learning how to spray "wet" and avoid runs. I don'tknow why y'all are trying to save money with non aero finishes. Seems more risky and waste of time to avoid aero systems that really work. Just my opinion as a first time builder. have at it!In a message dated 2/15/2009 9:03:55 P.M. Central Standard Time, taildrags(at)hotmail.com writes:Mikee-Since you are the builder of an award-winning Piet with agorgeous paint job, I accept your comments as extremelyvaluable. But if I may, I'd like to offer my observations onthe latex paint that I just applied side-by-side withPoly-Tone.1. Flexibility is NOT an issue! Fabric finished with latex isalmost TOO limp compared to conventional solvent-basedfinishes. I would be very, very surprised if latex paint evercracked on a fabric airplane, even directly in the drummingof a propwash area.2. When applied in full, thick coats latex seems quite proneto runs. Especially when applied using flow-out agents, Iwould be very surprised if a decent paint job could be laiddown on anything but a perfectly horizontal surface. BUT-I am NOT a painter! I just know that the paint needs togo down pretty heavily to block UV, and that makes itsusceptible to runs because it doesn't dry particularlyfast, compared with Poly-Tone.3. Standard Poly-Tone, when dry, appears to be closer toa flat paint finish than a satin or semi-gloss. I don't knowif you or others have added other finishes over the standardcolor coat to give it gloss or sheen, but the Poly-Tone I'veused is smooth but certainly not shiny. In that respect itmakes a fabric airplane look like a fabric airplane, but not ashiny one. Latex, on the other hand, gives a very smoothand satiny finish and there is no sign of the weave.4. I can't say anything about the crispness of maskededges with either finish since I haven't done that yet, butperhaps this is one area that you have a beef with? Whatparts of latex paint jobs that you've seen made you thinkthey looked lousy?I'm not defending either side here, just trying to learn.And you'll note from pictures of me that my ears are alwaysfully extended in listening mode ;o)Oscar ZunigaAir Camper NX41CCSan Antonio, TXmailto: taildrags(at)hotmail.comwebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List) (http://www.matronics.com/contribution) **************A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! bemailfooterNO62)________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:02:11 -0700Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Gary & Shad's motor mount