Original Posted By: "Gary Boothe"
To All,It has been a while since anyone has discussed basic stuff. And it has been a whilesince I posted anything about what I had been doing through the winter, soI thought I would do both. There is an old joke that asks "How do you make HolyWater? Answer: You boil the Hell out of it." Well, making cap strips is similar,except you steam the H*** out of it.I am a basic kind of guy. I am not a fancy builder who can build great lookingsteam cabinets, or other great looking and great working tools. And I suspectthat there are other, similar builders out there. So I guess I am trying to letother builders out there know that you don't have to be a master woodworkerto build this airplane (although there are many out there in this forum who dofit that description. Just not me). So here is how I have been bending my cap strips. You can see my fancy steamer.It is a cheapo, Walmart teapot, with the whistler removed. In its place I stucka length of PVC pipe with some JB Weld to (sort of) seal the joint. I justheated it and boiled/steamed the cap strips for about an hour. I then put themin the cap strip jig made from a 4X4 post. I paid a cabinet shop $10.00 to cutthe post to the arc that I marked. Why? Because they had a much better bandsaw than I did and could cut the jig much more accurately than I could. I likethe way that the nose of the cap strip fits securely in the slot, and then allI need are a couple clamps to hold things overnight.It ain't rocket science, and I hope that I motivate someone to get started on theirwing ribs.P.S. I loaded the pictures in the order I wanted, but they came out backwards.So "the last shall be first, and the first shall be last." You get thi idea.Also, in case you are wondering what the holes in the cap strip jig are for, theywere my initial idea that I could use plastic ties to hold the cap strips.Bad Idea. can't pull the ties tight enough. Clamps work better. Not all ideasare good ones!--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_ ... __________
Pietenpol-List: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
RE: Pietenpol-List: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
...or just soak overnight in cold water.Gary BootheNX308MB-----Original Message-----
...or just soak overnight in cold water.Gary BootheNX308MB-----Original Message-----
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "jarheadpilot82"
Tried that. Did not work. Snapped every time.I am building my wings using the Godforsaken Riblett airfoil and there may be alittle more curve in the upper cap strip than the original Pietenpol air foil.I am not sure, but That's why I steamed them.Thanks for commenting, though. I am just trying to motivate some other buildersto get going on their wing ribs.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Tried that. Did not work. Snapped every time.I am building my wings using the Godforsaken Riblett airfoil and there may be alittle more curve in the upper cap strip than the original Pietenpol air foil.I am not sure, but That's why I steamed them.Thanks for commenting, though. I am just trying to motivate some other buildersto get going on their wing ribs.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "dgaldrich"
I thought about trying that, Jack, but didn't know if the chlorine would have anyeffect on the wood.Also, I wanted to mention if anyone wants to borrow my upper and lower cap stripjigs for the Riblett airfoil, I would be happy to loan them. Just let me know.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
I thought about trying that, Jack, but didn't know if the chlorine would have anyeffect on the wood.Also, I wanted to mention if anyone wants to borrow my upper and lower cap stripjigs for the Riblett airfoil, I would be happy to loan them. Just let me know.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "jarheadpilot82"
I too made the Dread Riblett ribs and found that you also need to put a littlebend in the lower capstrips as well as the uppers. On somebody else's suggestion,I soaked mine overnight in a mixture of ammonia and water. 2 to 1 waterto ammonia??? In any event that worked reasonably well but there is a trick toputting them in the jig to avoid splitting. I found that if you put the frontin the jig and them work your way back, pressing the wood down onto the jigas it's bending, it split a lot less rather than putting one end in the jig andgrabbing the other end to force it down over the curve. YMMV.DaveRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
I too made the Dread Riblett ribs and found that you also need to put a littlebend in the lower capstrips as well as the uppers. On somebody else's suggestion,I soaked mine overnight in a mixture of ammonia and water. 2 to 1 waterto ammonia??? In any event that worked reasonably well but there is a trick toputting them in the jig to avoid splitting. I found that if you put the frontin the jig and them work your way back, pressing the wood down onto the jigas it's bending, it split a lot less rather than putting one end in the jig andgrabbing the other end to force it down over the curve. YMMV.DaveRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "Mark Roberts"
Dave,I maybe should have explained better for the non-Riblett users. You are correctthat the lower cap strip has a pretty healthy bend as well as the upper cap strip.I have separate jig for each. And my mileage was similar, in that usingmy hand to help the bending as opposed to just grabbing the tail of the cap stripand bending from the end made for much less splitting.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Dave,I maybe should have explained better for the non-Riblett users. You are correctthat the lower cap strip has a pretty healthy bend as well as the upper cap strip.I have separate jig for each. And my mileage was similar, in that usingmy hand to help the bending as opposed to just grabbing the tail of the cap stripand bending from the end made for much less splitting.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Mark,I, too, am using the "fat" 613.5 Riblett airfoil. Maybe that is where the extradifficulty was. Or maybe I am just a slow learner. Never thought of using thevacuum method. Very interesting.Jack,The fancy shop is my wife's fancy kitchen. Steaming cap strips is about the onlyuse of her kitchen I think I will be able to get away with.My goal in posting was to get a discussion going to, hopefully, motivate some peopleon the sidelines to get working on their wing ribs. I did not enjoy doingthem initially. But having just finished rib #16, I am starting to get intothe 'zen of the wing rib'. I am actually enjoying the time while concentratingon gluing. My mind focuses on that instead of all the other things going on aroundme.Pretty deep thinkin' for a Jarhead, I know. But I hope we hear from some new builderson the forum getting started. Come on in, the water's fine!--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 06:14:17 -0800 (PST)
Mark,I, too, am using the "fat" 613.5 Riblett airfoil. Maybe that is where the extradifficulty was. Or maybe I am just a slow learner. Never thought of using thevacuum method. Very interesting.Jack,The fancy shop is my wife's fancy kitchen. Steaming cap strips is about the onlyuse of her kitchen I think I will be able to get away with.My goal in posting was to get a discussion going to, hopefully, motivate some peopleon the sidelines to get working on their wing ribs. I did not enjoy doingthem initially. But having just finished rib #16, I am starting to get intothe 'zen of the wing rib'. I am actually enjoying the time while concentratingon gluing. My mind focuses on that instead of all the other things going on aroundme.Pretty deep thinkin' for a Jarhead, I know. But I hope we hear from some new builderson the forum getting started. Come on in, the water's fine!--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 06:14:17 -0800 (PST)
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "dgaldrich"
Michael,And Jack thinks I have a nice looking shop! Your jig looks nice. It only took me about three iterations of cap strip jigs aswell as wing rib jig to get something that I was happy with. You do very nicework. I wish I had your skills, but I hope that this discussion gets someonefrom the "this looks hard" phase to the "if Terry Hand can do it, anybody can"phase.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Michael,And Jack thinks I have a nice looking shop! Your jig looks nice. It only took me about three iterations of cap strip jigs aswell as wing rib jig to get something that I was happy with. You do very nicework. I wish I had your skills, but I hope that this discussion gets someonefrom the "this looks hard" phase to the "if Terry Hand can do it, anybody can"phase.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "jarheadpilot82"
TerryJust don't ask to use your wife's oven to powder coat metal parts...I remodeled our kitchen so I could confiscate the old oven to use for just thatpurpose.DaveRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
TerryJust don't ask to use your wife's oven to powder coat metal parts...I remodeled our kitchen so I could confiscate the old oven to use for just thatpurpose.DaveRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "echobravo4"
Dave,Actually I am looking for a (cheap) crappy oven on Craigslist that maybe the burnerson top are dead, so I can buy it and use it for powder coating. I am tryingto avoid the "kitchen remodel to get an oven" deal.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Dave,Actually I am looking for a (cheap) crappy oven on Craigslist that maybe the burnerson top are dead, so I can buy it and use it for powder coating. I am tryingto avoid the "kitchen remodel to get an oven" deal.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "jarheadpilot82"
Pretty much how I did it- nothing fancy!Didn't have as good results soaking--------Earl BrownI may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where Iintended to be.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/imag ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Pretty much how I did it- nothing fancy!Didn't have as good results soaking--------Earl BrownI may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where Iintended to be.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/imag ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: Kip and Beth Gardner
I am reminded of the story of NASA trying to design a writing instrument for spacethat would write in weightless conditions at any angle. Then we found outthat the Russians used pencils. That example may be an urban legend, but it makesthe point that things don't necessarily have to be complicated to work well.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
I am reminded of the story of NASA trying to design a writing instrument for spacethat would write in weightless conditions at any angle. Then we found outthat the Russians used pencils. That example may be an urban legend, but it makesthe point that things don't necessarily have to be complicated to work well.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: Tim White
Pencil used to be the 'gold standard' for any outdoor note taking for scientific purposes. Pencil will write on damp paper or wet 'waterproof' paper, and also is very hard to erase. Pen smears when wet, and many solvents dissolve inks. My only gripe is that pencils almost always need to be sharpened at the worst possible time.Kip GardnerOn Feb 23, 2013, at 10:47 AM, jarheadpilot82 wrote:> >>> I am reminded of the story of NASA trying to design a writing > instrument for space that would write in weightless conditions at > any angle. Then we found out that the Russians used pencils. That > example may be an urban legend, but it makes the point that things > don't necessarily have to be complicated to work well.>> --------> Semper Fi,>> Terry Hand> Athens, GA>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 12:12:55 -0500
Pencil used to be the 'gold standard' for any outdoor note taking for scientific purposes. Pencil will write on damp paper or wet 'waterproof' paper, and also is very hard to erase. Pen smears when wet, and many solvents dissolve inks. My only gripe is that pencils almost always need to be sharpened at the worst possible time.Kip GardnerOn Feb 23, 2013, at 10:47 AM, jarheadpilot82 wrote:> >>> I am reminded of the story of NASA trying to design a writing > instrument for space that would write in weightless conditions at > any angle. Then we found out that the Russians used pencils. That > example may be an urban legend, but it makes the point that things > don't necessarily have to be complicated to work well.>> --------> Semper Fi,>> Terry Hand> Athens, GA>>> Read this topic online here:>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ______Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2013 12:12:55 -0500
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "jarheadpilot82"
Thanks to everyone who has given positive suggestions as to how to prep their capstrips for bending in the jig. What I really hope is that someone who has beenthinking of starting the wing ribs reads all of this and it motivates themto get started.Thanks!--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Thanks to everyone who has given positive suggestions as to how to prep their capstrips for bending in the jig. What I really hope is that someone who has beenthinking of starting the wing ribs reads all of this and it motivates themto get started.Thanks!--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: Wayne Bressler
That is one great jig. How many of the rest of uswere smart enough to make a jig that allowsinstalling the gussets on BOTH sides at the sametime?? Well, I didn't! :-)I just passed my ribs across my disc sander to get rid of the proud bits. Regardless of whatyou use just remember that just because youstop moving the machine doesn't! And don'tworry about glue squeeze out. Just spread itout on the wood. You have to seal it anyway.ClifEverything should be made as simple as possible,but not simpler. Einstein>. Mine may go down as the ugliest jig ever presented on this forum, but I have included pictures of the end result in order to show you that the ribs match up quite well. > I am sure you are wondering how I am going to take care of the gussets extending past the edge of the cap strips. I plan to either carefully use my trusty bandsaw to remove the "proud " portion, or my router table with a flush bit. Any suggestions are gladly accepted.> Semper Fi,>> Terry Hand> Athens, GA________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
That is one great jig. How many of the rest of uswere smart enough to make a jig that allowsinstalling the gussets on BOTH sides at the sametime?? Well, I didn't! :-)I just passed my ribs across my disc sander to get rid of the proud bits. Regardless of whatyou use just remember that just because youstop moving the machine doesn't! And don'tworry about glue squeeze out. Just spread itout on the wood. You have to seal it anyway.ClifEverything should be made as simple as possible,but not simpler. Einstein>. Mine may go down as the ugliest jig ever presented on this forum, but I have included pictures of the end result in order to show you that the ribs match up quite well. > I am sure you are wondering how I am going to take care of the gussets extending past the edge of the cap strips. I plan to either carefully use my trusty bandsaw to remove the "proud " portion, or my router table with a flush bit. Any suggestions are gladly accepted.> Semper Fi,>> Terry Hand> Athens, GA________________________________________________________________________________Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "Jack"
Terry,Consider looking for one at a Habitat for Humanity Re-Store. They sell all kindsof stuff leftover from remodels, etc, and often at very low prices. A quickgoogle search should tell you if there's one in your area.Wayne BresslerTaildraggers, Inc.www.taildraggersinc.comOn Feb 23, 2013, at 10:15 AM, "jarheadpilot82" wrote:> > Dave,> > Actually I am looking for a (cheap) crappy oven on Craigslist that maybe theburners on top are dead, so I can buy it and use it for powder coating. I am tryingto avoid the "kitchen remodel to get an oven" deal.> > --------> Semper Fi,> > Terry Hand> Athens, GA> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 863#394863> > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Terry,Consider looking for one at a Habitat for Humanity Re-Store. They sell all kindsof stuff leftover from remodels, etc, and often at very low prices. A quickgoogle search should tell you if there's one in your area.Wayne BresslerTaildraggers, Inc.www.taildraggersinc.comOn Feb 23, 2013, at 10:15 AM, "jarheadpilot82" wrote:> > Dave,> > Actually I am looking for a (cheap) crappy oven on Craigslist that maybe theburners on top are dead, so I can buy it and use it for powder coating. I am tryingto avoid the "kitchen remodel to get an oven" deal.> > --------> Semper Fi,> > Terry Hand> Athens, GA> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... 863#394863> > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Re: Why Is Steaming Cap Strips Like Making Holy Water?
Original Posted By: "Scott Knowlton "
Wayne and Kip,Thanks for the idea. I had forgotten about the Habitat for Humanity ReStore. Iwas just looking on Craigslist. I will let you know what I find.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Wayne and Kip,Thanks for the idea. I had forgotten about the Habitat for Humanity ReStore. Iwas just looking on Craigslist. I will let you know what I find.--------Semper Fi,Terry HandAthens, GARead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________