Original Posted By: Steven Dortch
Subject: Pietenpol-List: A65 carb attachment
Pietenpol-List: A65 carb attachment
Pietenpol-List: Re: First Engine Start - No Joy
Original Posted By: "dgaldrich"
Mike,You probably have done this, but number one, tie the tail down with a rope andknots that you would feel comfortable restraining a pit bull next to an elementaryschool playground with. Do not trust wheel chocks nor brakes. If it startsunexpectedly, your throttle and mag switch may not be set, and have a CO2 fireextinguisher on hand. 10 years ago a FL Piet project was largely destroyedon the first start for want of 6 feet of rope. Any engine that is giving troublestarting is a distraction, and is creating a situation that could lead to inattentionon the brakes.Two hours is a lot of hand propping on a warm day to not have a single hint oflife. Even if you don't know the starting drill on a 65 yet, in 120 minutes youwill have by random chance a pop over if everything is set right. Go back andcheck things. Popping over on starter fluid does not correct what is out ofadjustment. You don't need the motor to run to time the mags and verify floatheight.Now comes the stuff only a tactless person would say: If the guy who is teachingyou about hand propping a 65 doesn't already know every single thing that hasbeen written by Jack and the other's he is the wrong guy to be helping you.Hand propping and diagnosing engine issues are skills to learn, but if your guydoesn't know what is going on in 2 hours, you need a better in person assistant,or to have the realization that you are on your own. You can not imaginehow many people I speak to every year who are new to airplanes and have 'a buddy'who is just providing a false sense of progress and security while the stumbleon.Tactless part #2. If in any way shape or form, it turns out that your 'carb rebuild' or any of the adjustments to it are the starting issue, take it as a warning shot from the universe not to play aircraft mechanic on critical items. Sounds harsh, but read this story about a guy I knew who insisted that anyone could rebuild an airplane carb, that hubris and an internal mistake, killed him on the first flight: http://flycorvair.net/2013/04/20/risk-m ... -place/Not to hurt your feelings but your tone on carbs reminds me of Ken. I asked him3 times to have a pro check it, he died a week later.Any engine, Continental, Corvair or Lycoming, if it is set correctly should start near instantly on a warm day, even if it has never started before. The average crank time on a brand new Corvair at a College is 3 seconds. A perfectly set new 65 should light on maybe 5 blade pulls. Tactless part #3: if the best prep work you can do before a start test doesn't work, take it as an important sign that you need to re-evaluate what you think you know, and who you think you are learning it from. It should not take two hours of pulling on a prop and an email from a tactless jackass in Florida to have a 'moment of awareness' on this. In the past you have offered a lot of information for sale for a guy who can't start an engine today. I have been an A&P for 24 years, but I still touch every plane cognizant that safety is only found after you discard the myth of personal infallibility. If you would like to learn more, This link has stories of a number of friends of mine, all dead now: http://flycorvair.net/2014/01/21/risk-m ... ence-page/ -ww.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: First Engine Start - No Joy
Mike,You probably have done this, but number one, tie the tail down with a rope andknots that you would feel comfortable restraining a pit bull next to an elementaryschool playground with. Do not trust wheel chocks nor brakes. If it startsunexpectedly, your throttle and mag switch may not be set, and have a CO2 fireextinguisher on hand. 10 years ago a FL Piet project was largely destroyedon the first start for want of 6 feet of rope. Any engine that is giving troublestarting is a distraction, and is creating a situation that could lead to inattentionon the brakes.Two hours is a lot of hand propping on a warm day to not have a single hint oflife. Even if you don't know the starting drill on a 65 yet, in 120 minutes youwill have by random chance a pop over if everything is set right. Go back andcheck things. Popping over on starter fluid does not correct what is out ofadjustment. You don't need the motor to run to time the mags and verify floatheight.Now comes the stuff only a tactless person would say: If the guy who is teachingyou about hand propping a 65 doesn't already know every single thing that hasbeen written by Jack and the other's he is the wrong guy to be helping you.Hand propping and diagnosing engine issues are skills to learn, but if your guydoesn't know what is going on in 2 hours, you need a better in person assistant,or to have the realization that you are on your own. You can not imaginehow many people I speak to every year who are new to airplanes and have 'a buddy'who is just providing a false sense of progress and security while the stumbleon.Tactless part #2. If in any way shape or form, it turns out that your 'carb rebuild' or any of the adjustments to it are the starting issue, take it as a warning shot from the universe not to play aircraft mechanic on critical items. Sounds harsh, but read this story about a guy I knew who insisted that anyone could rebuild an airplane carb, that hubris and an internal mistake, killed him on the first flight: http://flycorvair.net/2013/04/20/risk-m ... -place/Not to hurt your feelings but your tone on carbs reminds me of Ken. I asked him3 times to have a pro check it, he died a week later.Any engine, Continental, Corvair or Lycoming, if it is set correctly should start near instantly on a warm day, even if it has never started before. The average crank time on a brand new Corvair at a College is 3 seconds. A perfectly set new 65 should light on maybe 5 blade pulls. Tactless part #3: if the best prep work you can do before a start test doesn't work, take it as an important sign that you need to re-evaluate what you think you know, and who you think you are learning it from. It should not take two hours of pulling on a prop and an email from a tactless jackass in Florida to have a 'moment of awareness' on this. In the past you have offered a lot of information for sale for a guy who can't start an engine today. I have been an A&P for 24 years, but I still touch every plane cognizant that safety is only found after you discard the myth of personal infallibility. If you would like to learn more, This link has stories of a number of friends of mine, all dead now: http://flycorvair.net/2014/01/21/risk-m ... ence-page/ -ww.Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: First Engine Start - No Joy
Original Posted By: "Jack Phillips"
One last cautionary tale. We have a Piper Cub with an A-75. During it's lastannual, the mechanic had the mag switch OFF preparing for an engine run and pulledthe engine through slowly. It was cold and unprimed but started anyway.Scared the crap out of him. He DID have it safely tied to a concrete post andchocked so there was no further drama. Turned out there was crud in the 60+year old switch and it provided a path for the p-lead.The lesson to be taken from this was mentioned earlier. ALWAYS treat the engineas "live" if it's completely assembled.DaveRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
One last cautionary tale. We have a Piper Cub with an A-75. During it's lastannual, the mechanic had the mag switch OFF preparing for an engine run and pulledthe engine through slowly. It was cold and unprimed but started anyway.Scared the crap out of him. He DID have it safely tied to a concrete post andchocked so there was no further drama. Turned out there was crud in the 60+year old switch and it provided a path for the p-lead.The lesson to be taken from this was mentioned earlier. ALWAYS treat the engineas "live" if it's completely assembled.DaveRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... __________
Pietenpol-List: Re: A65 carb attachment
Original Posted By: "taildrags"
I flew 1.2 again this morning. Took an old friend of mine. It was his first ridein the Piet. He was smiling ear to ear when we got back.--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: A65 carb attachment
I flew 1.2 again this morning. Took an old friend of mine. It was his first ridein the Piet. He was smiling ear to ear when we got back.--------Scott LiefeldFlying N11MS since March 1972Steel TubeC-85-12Wire WheelsBrodhead in 1996Read this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ___Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: A65 carb attachment
Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Steve; are you talking about the blue bracket ahead of the carb in the pictureattached? I asked the same question and got varied answers. 41CC has alwayshad that bracket but the original one broke in the nose-over. When I found outhow much the Continental part cost, I made my own.--------Oscar ZunigaMedford, ORAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"A75 powerRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/a75f ... ______Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2014 14:59:05 -0700
Steve; are you talking about the blue bracket ahead of the carb in the pictureattached? I asked the same question and got varied answers. 41CC has alwayshad that bracket but the original one broke in the nose-over. When I found outhow much the Continental part cost, I made my own.--------Oscar ZunigaMedford, ORAir Camper NX41CC "Scout"A75 powerRead this topic online here:http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.p ... ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/a75f ... ______Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2014 14:59:05 -0700
Re: Pietenpol-List: First Engine Start - No Joy
Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: First Engine Start - No Joy
Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: First Engine Start - No Joy
Original Posted By: Michael Perez