Original Posted By: Rcaprd(at)aol.com
Use the 27 3/4" between spars dimension and use the dimensionsgiven on page 5 to layout the upper and lower surfaces of the airfoil.After you have marked all the upper and lower points on your ribfixture board, then use a thin wood spline of about 3/16" thick andabout 6ft long to connect all the "dots". You will find a "flyer" ortwo so go with the spline to fair the airfoil curve.Some of the dimensional locations of the trusses of the rib are calledout but most are not. Locate them as generally shown.Mylar is the medium of choice when it comes to a stable material todraw aircraft parts on, paper is only accurate for a very short timeafter drawing on and soon grows or shrinks with humidity. MooneyAircraft keeps all their aircraft drawings (mylar) in a temperature andhumidity controlled room, and I suspect the other manufacturers do too. However, mylar has been surplanted by computers as the bestplace to store aircraft manufacturing data for the big boys. Alas, forus, we are left with the old fashion way, co-ordinate points, flexiablespline and lead ducks, and a sharp pointed pencil.RodgerPiet in progress________________________________________________________________________________
Pietenpol-List: Wing Rib Question
Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing rib question
Original Posted By: Daryl R Meece
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing rib question
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing rib question
Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing rib question
Original Posted By: Kirk Huizenga
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing rib questionIn a message dated 7/1/00 10:20:46 PM Central Daylight Time, dickdery(at)teleport.com writes:>I used the spacing of 27 3/4", as called out in the plans. This dimension is required to meet the spacings of the cabane struts, and lift struts, then the wing can be adjusted for and aft, when the weight and ballance is done. This wing adjustment is one of the unique, and ingenius things about the Pietenpol. Come to think about it, we are not adjusting the wing above the fuselage, but we are adjusting the fuselage beneith the wing...the wing is the 'air plane' and everything else is used to control the wing. I used 4 3/4" X 3/4" spars, which required 1/8" shims at the front of the rear spar, and the rear of the front spar. I also mitered the ends of each diagnal, to butt right up to each other, and numbered each piece. It took several tries for each one (on that first rib), but once I got one right, I would cut about 40 or 45 clones, then picked the best one, when I began the mass assembly. If I were to do it over again, I would adjust the dimensions between the uprights to eliminate the requirement of those 1/8" shims. The ribs will now be referred to as 'L1'- Left 1st rib. 'R1' - Right 1st rib. There are 14 ribs on each side. The center rib will be referred to as 'C'. Build new rib jig, so that the gussets and the upright x next to the spars, are spaced 28 1/16" to 28 1/8" apart. This should be the exact dimention between the spars, with the exception of the 3 center ribs, and the outboard ribs where the struts attach. These locations have 1/8" plywood doublers on each side of the spar, and should be football shaped on the ends of these doublers. Leave the gussets off in 2 locations. On the lower forward side of the front spar, and on the aft upper side of the aft spar. Install these gussets after the ribs have been assembled to the spars. This will allow the ribs to be slid on to the 3/4" spars, and ensure a nice tight fit. Other gussets to be left off are on the ribs at the inboard aileron station. On this rib, leave the outboard (trailing edge) gusset off, for the later installation of the aileron blank plywood (1/16"). The center section of the wing, forward of the front spar, is designed so as to allow the top of the radiator to be within the wing. Two 1/8" plywood L.E. ribs, are spaced evenly between, and paralell to, R1 and L1. These ribs will accept the 1/16" plywood L.E. (on top), and the 1/32" plywood (within the radiator cavity). The barn door hinges are numbered 1 thru 6, beginning on the left wing tip. Lots of places on the wing needed to be drilled using Granpap's hand crank drill (chordless !!), because of clearance reasons. Cable guide blocks were numbered 1 thru 8, starting at the top left. Jury strut C/L is 37" outboard of C/L of cabane strut attachments. I estimated the placement of the jury strut attachments by referring to the picture of the Pietenpol on the 1999 I A M Union Calender. The ribs were weighted, without varnish, and the heaviest ones were installed inboard, progressively installing the lighter ones toward the wingips. The two inboard ribs are the only ones that are made out of Spruce, the rest of the ribs are made out of Western Cedar. LEFT SIDE RIGHT SIDE 1.) 7.24 oz Spruce 1.) 7.4 oz Spruce 2.) 7.8 oz All other ribs are Cedar 2.) 7.96 oz All other ribs are Cedar 3.) 7.91 oz 3.) 7.93 oz 4.) 7.5 oz 4.) 7.91 oz 5.) 6.58 oz 5.) 6.56 oz 6.) 7.94 oz 6.) 6.34 oz 7.) 6.4 oz 7.) 6.44 oz 8.) 7.93 oz 8.) 6.4 oz 9.) 6.44 oz 9.) 6.3 oz 10.) 6.34 oz 10.) 6.25 oz 11.) 6.29 oz 11.) 6.2 oz 12.) 6.22 oz 12.) 6.17 oz 13.) 6.15 oz 13.) 6.14 oz 14.) 6.1 oz 14.) 6.09 ozAnother discrepency I had, after the ribs were all in place on the spars, was that in 4 locations, the drag / anti-drag cables fouled the diagnals. In those locations, in order to keep the cables straight, I carved a notch in the diagnal, and glued a re-inforcement to the opposite side of the fouling.Chuck Gantzer________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sun, 2 Jul 2000 08:24:34 -0500
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing rib questionIn a message dated 7/1/00 10:20:46 PM Central Daylight Time, dickdery(at)teleport.com writes:>I used the spacing of 27 3/4", as called out in the plans. This dimension is required to meet the spacings of the cabane struts, and lift struts, then the wing can be adjusted for and aft, when the weight and ballance is done. This wing adjustment is one of the unique, and ingenius things about the Pietenpol. Come to think about it, we are not adjusting the wing above the fuselage, but we are adjusting the fuselage beneith the wing...the wing is the 'air plane' and everything else is used to control the wing. I used 4 3/4" X 3/4" spars, which required 1/8" shims at the front of the rear spar, and the rear of the front spar. I also mitered the ends of each diagnal, to butt right up to each other, and numbered each piece. It took several tries for each one (on that first rib), but once I got one right, I would cut about 40 or 45 clones, then picked the best one, when I began the mass assembly. If I were to do it over again, I would adjust the dimensions between the uprights to eliminate the requirement of those 1/8" shims. The ribs will now be referred to as 'L1'- Left 1st rib. 'R1' - Right 1st rib. There are 14 ribs on each side. The center rib will be referred to as 'C'. Build new rib jig, so that the gussets and the upright x next to the spars, are spaced 28 1/16" to 28 1/8" apart. This should be the exact dimention between the spars, with the exception of the 3 center ribs, and the outboard ribs where the struts attach. These locations have 1/8" plywood doublers on each side of the spar, and should be football shaped on the ends of these doublers. Leave the gussets off in 2 locations. On the lower forward side of the front spar, and on the aft upper side of the aft spar. Install these gussets after the ribs have been assembled to the spars. This will allow the ribs to be slid on to the 3/4" spars, and ensure a nice tight fit. Other gussets to be left off are on the ribs at the inboard aileron station. On this rib, leave the outboard (trailing edge) gusset off, for the later installation of the aileron blank plywood (1/16"). The center section of the wing, forward of the front spar, is designed so as to allow the top of the radiator to be within the wing. Two 1/8" plywood L.E. ribs, are spaced evenly between, and paralell to, R1 and L1. These ribs will accept the 1/16" plywood L.E. (on top), and the 1/32" plywood (within the radiator cavity). The barn door hinges are numbered 1 thru 6, beginning on the left wing tip. Lots of places on the wing needed to be drilled using Granpap's hand crank drill (chordless !!), because of clearance reasons. Cable guide blocks were numbered 1 thru 8, starting at the top left. Jury strut C/L is 37" outboard of C/L of cabane strut attachments. I estimated the placement of the jury strut attachments by referring to the picture of the Pietenpol on the 1999 I A M Union Calender. The ribs were weighted, without varnish, and the heaviest ones were installed inboard, progressively installing the lighter ones toward the wingips. The two inboard ribs are the only ones that are made out of Spruce, the rest of the ribs are made out of Western Cedar. LEFT SIDE RIGHT SIDE 1.) 7.24 oz Spruce 1.) 7.4 oz Spruce 2.) 7.8 oz All other ribs are Cedar 2.) 7.96 oz All other ribs are Cedar 3.) 7.91 oz 3.) 7.93 oz 4.) 7.5 oz 4.) 7.91 oz 5.) 6.58 oz 5.) 6.56 oz 6.) 7.94 oz 6.) 6.34 oz 7.) 6.4 oz 7.) 6.44 oz 8.) 7.93 oz 8.) 6.4 oz 9.) 6.44 oz 9.) 6.3 oz 10.) 6.34 oz 10.) 6.25 oz 11.) 6.29 oz 11.) 6.2 oz 12.) 6.22 oz 12.) 6.17 oz 13.) 6.15 oz 13.) 6.14 oz 14.) 6.1 oz 14.) 6.09 ozAnother discrepency I had, after the ribs were all in place on the spars, was that in 4 locations, the drag / anti-drag cables fouled the diagnals. In those locations, in order to keep the cables straight, I carved a notch in the diagnal, and glued a re-inforcement to the opposite side of the fouling.Chuck Gantzer________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sun, 2 Jul 2000 08:24:34 -0500
Re: Pietenpol-List: Piet ceiling?
Original Posted By: "Carl Loar"
Hi Kirk, The prop on G-BUCO is basically a home-made copy of the 'Evra D1128 B' as found on a Jodel. I borrowed the original for the test flying andused Eric Clutton's excellent little book on propeller making to carve myown. It was quite straightforward to do, the most time consuming part wasfinding , selecting and gluing up the timber for the blank. If you canbuild a Pietenpol, then you have all the skills & patience to carve a prop -and its a very rewarding experience. Size is a nominal 72" x 50" .Regards - Alan________________________________________________________________________________
Hi Kirk, The prop on G-BUCO is basically a home-made copy of the 'Evra D1128 B' as found on a Jodel. I borrowed the original for the test flying andused Eric Clutton's excellent little book on propeller making to carve myown. It was quite straightforward to do, the most time consuming part wasfinding , selecting and gluing up the timber for the blank. If you canbuild a Pietenpol, then you have all the skills & patience to carve a prop -and its a very rewarding experience. Size is a nominal 72" x 50" .Regards - Alan________________________________________________________________________________
RE: Pietenpol-List: Piet ceiling?
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Alan,,,, I got the Eric Clutton prop book recently. I plan on giving ita try also. When I used the formula with the power curve, I came out witha 64" x 34" for the corvair engine. Is the 72"x 50" for a Ford engine?Also, what type of wood did you use?Thanks,,, Carl-----Original Message-----
Alan,,,, I got the Eric Clutton prop book recently. I plan on giving ita try also. When I used the formula with the power curve, I came out witha 64" x 34" for the corvair engine. Is the 72"x 50" for a Ford engine?Also, what type of wood did you use?Thanks,,, Carl-----Original Message-----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Piet ceiling?
Original Posted By: Carl Loar
Hi Carl, G-BUCO is powered by a 90hp Continental and the prop is carved fromlaminations of Maple. Its fairly tough to carve but makes for a very robustprop. I have also made them in mahogany which is a lot easier to carve butyou have to be a little more careful to protect the leading edge fromdamage. So far all the Piets in the United Kingdom are powered byContinentals, the authorities here don't exactly encourage the use ofconverted car motors unless its a VW. There are a few 'Subaru ' poweredPiets being built though, and we should see the first getting airborne earlynext year, in the meantime I'm dreaming of the day when I can come overthere and get a ride in a genuine 'A' powered machine. It will happen -dreams do come true.Regards - Alan-----Original Message-----
Hi Carl, G-BUCO is powered by a 90hp Continental and the prop is carved fromlaminations of Maple. Its fairly tough to carve but makes for a very robustprop. I have also made them in mahogany which is a lot easier to carve butyou have to be a little more careful to protect the leading edge fromdamage. So far all the Piets in the United Kingdom are powered byContinentals, the authorities here don't exactly encourage the use ofconverted car motors unless its a VW. There are a few 'Subaru ' poweredPiets being built though, and we should see the first getting airborne earlynext year, in the meantime I'm dreaming of the day when I can come overthere and get a ride in a genuine 'A' powered machine. It will happen -dreams do come true.Regards - Alan-----Original Message-----
> Re: Pietenpol-List: Piet ceiling?
Original Posted By: Richard DeCosta
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Piet ceiling?>>Alan,,,, I got the Eric Clutton prop book recently. I plan on giving it>a try also. When I used the formula with the power curve, I came out with>a 64" x 34" for the corvair engine. Is the 72"x 50" for a Ford engine?>Also, what type of wood did you use?>Thanks,,, Carl>>-----Original Message----->From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Alan>Maragret & Debbie James>Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2000 4:38 PM>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Piet ceiling?>>>>>Hi Kirk, The prop on G-BUCO is basically a home-made copy of the 'Evra D11>28 B' as found on a Jodel. I borrowed the original for the test flying and>used Eric Clutton's excellent little book on propeller making to carve my>own. It was quite straightforward to do, the most time consuming part was>finding , selecting and gluing up the timber for the blank. If you can>build a Pietenpol, then you have all the skills & patience to carve aprop ->and its a very rewarding experience. Size is a nominal 72" x 50" .>Regards - Alan>>________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sun, 2 Jul 2000 19:16:00 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Piet ceiling?>>Alan,,,, I got the Eric Clutton prop book recently. I plan on giving it>a try also. When I used the formula with the power curve, I came out with>a 64" x 34" for the corvair engine. Is the 72"x 50" for a Ford engine?>Also, what type of wood did you use?>Thanks,,, Carl>>-----Original Message----->From: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com]On Behalf Of Alan>Maragret & Debbie James>Sent: Sunday, July 02, 2000 4:38 PM>To: pietenpol-list(at)matronics.com>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Piet ceiling?>>>>>Hi Kirk, The prop on G-BUCO is basically a home-made copy of the 'Evra D11>28 B' as found on a Jodel. I borrowed the original for the test flying and>used Eric Clutton's excellent little book on propeller making to carve my>own. It was quite straightforward to do, the most time consuming part was>finding , selecting and gluing up the timber for the blank. If you can>build a Pietenpol, then you have all the skills & patience to carve aprop ->and its a very rewarding experience. Size is a nominal 72" x 50" .>Regards - Alan>>________________________________________________________________________________Date: Sun, 2 Jul 2000 19:16:00 -0700 (PDT)
RE: Pietenpol-List: horiz stab upper camber?
Original Posted By:> Richard DeCosta[SMTP:aircamper(at)yahoo.com]
I did the exact same thing but on the rudder. To try and salvage my mistakeI notched the main spar so the ribs would have the same symetrical curvatureon both sides. I did a pretty good job of notching the main beam for theribs to recess into on one side and probably would have been ok. Afterlooking at it for about a year and, knowing that it wasn't perfect, I tookthe hacksaw to it and ripped out the ribs and main beam and installed a newbeam and ribs. Now I don't have to stare at it in disgust every time I passit in the shop! > ----------
I did the exact same thing but on the rudder. To try and salvage my mistakeI notched the main spar so the ribs would have the same symetrical curvatureon both sides. I did a pretty good job of notching the main beam for theribs to recess into on one side and probably would have been ok. Afterlooking at it for about a year and, knowing that it wasn't perfect, I tookthe hacksaw to it and ripped out the ribs and main beam and installed a newbeam and ribs. Now I don't have to stare at it in disgust every time I passit in the shop! > ----------