Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Got22b,-I and others would like to address you by name :0)---We are very friendly here.- Anyway, yes I have photos on my home computer of these end fittings with the aluminum struts. I will make myself a note to post them tonight.- -Dan HelsperPoplar Grove, IL.Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, no registration required and great graphics ' check it out!________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 11:10:06 -0700 (PDT)
Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Struts
Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Struts
Original Posted By: Isablcorky(at)aol.com
Got22b,I and others would like to address you by name :0) We are veryfriendly here. Anyway, yes I have photos on my home computer of theseend fittings with the aluminum struts. I will make myself a note to postthem tonight. Dan HelsperPoplar Grove, IL. _____ Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, noregistration required and great graphics - check it out!=http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001> " target=_blankrel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... s.comblank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/contribution__ ... ______This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged, proprietaryor otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the senderimmediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is prohibited.Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - Norsk - Portuguese________________________________________________________________________________
Got22b,I and others would like to address you by name :0) We are veryfriendly here. Anyway, yes I have photos on my home computer of theseend fittings with the aluminum struts. I will make myself a note to postthem tonight. Dan HelsperPoplar Grove, IL. _____ Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, noregistration required and great graphics - check it out!=http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001> " target=_blankrel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet ... s.comblank rel=nofollow>http://www.matronics.com/contribution__ ... ______This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged, proprietaryor otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the senderimmediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is prohibited.Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - Norsk - Portuguese________________________________________________________________________________
RE: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Struts
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
Michael,-You probably don't want to be welding the aluminum struts anyway. Many aluminum alloys will lose a significant amount of strength in the area adjacent to the weld. For instance,-with 6061-T6 (the alloy the Sky-Tek struts are made of), the design stress (in bending) drops from 24,000 psi to 14,000 psi within 1 inch of the weld. That is a very significant loss (more than 40%). The extreme heat of welding changes the molecular structure of the aluminum, resulting in localized reduced physical strength. The best approach for structural aluminum parts is to use mechanical fastening, rather than welding.But there are lots of other areas on this wooden-airplane-that will need to be welded. So you will eventually either need to learn that skill, or find someone else that has the skill to do it for you.Steel struts are another story. No issues with loss of strength in the weld areas with steel.-Bill C.
Michael,-You probably don't want to be welding the aluminum struts anyway. Many aluminum alloys will lose a significant amount of strength in the area adjacent to the weld. For instance,-with 6061-T6 (the alloy the Sky-Tek struts are made of), the design stress (in bending) drops from 24,000 psi to 14,000 psi within 1 inch of the weld. That is a very significant loss (more than 40%). The extreme heat of welding changes the molecular structure of the aluminum, resulting in localized reduced physical strength. The best approach for structural aluminum parts is to use mechanical fastening, rather than welding.But there are lots of other areas on this wooden-airplane-that will need to be welded. So you will eventually either need to learn that skill, or find someone else that has the skill to do it for you.Steel struts are another story. No issues with loss of strength in the weld areas with steel.-Bill C.
RE: Pietenpol-List: Struts and supports
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
Michael,-Yes, some builders use aluminum struts. They are generally much cheaper than new 4130 streamline tubing. Here is one source:http://www.sky-tek.com/struts.html-Also check out DJ Vegh's website:http://www.imagedv.com/aircamper/log/im ... 3.htm-Paul Poulin, the builder of the Canadian Piet mentioned by Jack, commented that he built his wooden lift struts (solid laminated White Ash) and then weighed them and found them to be slightly lighter than streamlined steel lift struts from a Piper Tri-Pacer (I think).-I like Jack Phillips' Number One reason not to use round steel tubing as-is. They-ARE ugly.Using round steel tubing, faired with wood, and wrapped with -tape, then doped was a typical practice-used on aircraft of the same vintage as the Pietenpol (see attached detail from Corben Cabin Ace plans).-There has been quite a bit of discussion about this stuff in the past. If you've got a bit of time on your hands,-check the archives.
Michael,-Yes, some builders use aluminum struts. They are generally much cheaper than new 4130 streamline tubing. Here is one source:http://www.sky-tek.com/struts.html-Also check out DJ Vegh's website:http://www.imagedv.com/aircamper/log/im ... 3.htm-Paul Poulin, the builder of the Canadian Piet mentioned by Jack, commented that he built his wooden lift struts (solid laminated White Ash) and then weighed them and found them to be slightly lighter than streamlined steel lift struts from a Piper Tri-Pacer (I think).-I like Jack Phillips' Number One reason not to use round steel tubing as-is. They-ARE ugly.Using round steel tubing, faired with wood, and wrapped with -tape, then doped was a typical practice-used on aircraft of the same vintage as the Pietenpol (see attached detail from Corben Cabin Ace plans).-There has been quite a bit of discussion about this stuff in the past. If you've got a bit of time on your hands,-check the archives.
Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Struts
Original Posted By: "Scott Schreiber"
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum StrutsLarry Williams has been flying his airplane with the aluminum Skytech struts for years now. These are the same ones I put on my airplane. Advantage is less weight. If you don't want to attempt welding these (which I didn't) youhave to insert and attach the end fittings with AN bolts. I used 7075 aluminum rectangular bar stock for the end fittings McMaster Carr Supply # 9055K13 $48.38 for 3 lineal feet. Worked great. Dan HelsperPoplar Grove, IL.**************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, no registration required and great graphics =93 check it out! http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)________________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum StrutsLarry Williams has been flying his airplane with the aluminum Skytech struts for years now. These are the same ones I put on my airplane. Advantage is less weight. If you don't want to attempt welding these (which I didn't) youhave to insert and attach the end fittings with AN bolts. I used 7075 aluminum rectangular bar stock for the end fittings McMaster Carr Supply # 9055K13 $48.38 for 3 lineal feet. Worked great. Dan HelsperPoplar Grove, IL.**************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, no registration required and great graphics =93 check it out! http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)________________________________________________________________________________
Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Struts
Original Posted By: HelsperSew(at)aol.com
That is a great option! I have the skytechs and am getting near the stage of making the ends and I am trying to work though that. Got anypictures? ----- Original Message -----
That is a great option! I have the skytechs and am getting near the stage of making the ends and I am trying to work though that. Got anypictures? ----- Original Message -----
Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Struts
Original Posted By: Michael Perez
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum StrutsGot22b,I and others would like to address you by name :0) We are very friendly here. Anyway, yes I have photos on my home computer of these end fittings with the aluminum struts. I will make myself a note to post them tonight. Dan HelsperPoplar Grove, IL.**************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, no registration required and great graphics =93 check it out! http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 11:09:21 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum StrutsGot22b,I and others would like to address you by name :0) We are very friendly here. Anyway, yes I have photos on my home computer of these end fittings with the aluminum struts. I will make myself a note to post them tonight. Dan HelsperPoplar Grove, IL.**************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, no registration required and great graphics =93 check it out! http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 11:09:21 -0700 (PDT)
RE: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Struts
Original Posted By: "Phillips, Jack"
RE: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Struts
Original Posted By: owner-pietenpol-list-server(at)matronics.com
Michael,You probably don't want to be welding the aluminum struts anyway. Manyaluminum alloys will lose a significant amount of strength in the areaadjacent to the weld. For instance, with 6061-T6 (the alloy the Sky-Tekstruts are made of), the design stress (in bending) drops from 24,000 psi to14,000 psi within 1 inch of the weld. That is a very significant loss (morethan 40%). The extreme heat of welding changes the molecular structure ofthe aluminum, resulting in localized reduced physical strength. The bestapproach for structural aluminum parts is to use mechanical fastening,rather than welding.But there are lots of other areas on this wooden airplane that will need tobe welded. So you will eventually either need to learn that skill, or findsomeone else that has the skill to do it for you.Steel struts are another story. No issues with loss of strength in the weldareas with steel.Bill C. _____
Michael,You probably don't want to be welding the aluminum struts anyway. Manyaluminum alloys will lose a significant amount of strength in the areaadjacent to the weld. For instance, with 6061-T6 (the alloy the Sky-Tekstruts are made of), the design stress (in bending) drops from 24,000 psi to14,000 psi within 1 inch of the weld. That is a very significant loss (morethan 40%). The extreme heat of welding changes the molecular structure ofthe aluminum, resulting in localized reduced physical strength. The bestapproach for structural aluminum parts is to use mechanical fastening,rather than welding.But there are lots of other areas on this wooden airplane that will need tobe welded. So you will eventually either need to learn that skill, or findsomeone else that has the skill to do it for you.Steel struts are another story. No issues with loss of strength in the weldareas with steel.Bill C. _____
Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Struts
Original Posted By: charles loomis
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum StrutsRyan,I actually used the small struts on both. This is what Larry Williams used. I thought the large ones were overkill. When you think about it, the Piet has redundancy in that regard, with 4 strut attach points vs. 2, when compared to a cub or champ. Dan **************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, no registration required and great graphics =93 check it out! http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 14:08:08 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum StrutsRyan,I actually used the small struts on both. This is what Larry Williams used. I thought the large ones were overkill. When you think about it, the Piet has redundancy in that regard, with 4 strut attach points vs. 2, when compared to a cub or champ. Dan **************Play online games for FREE at Games.com! All of your favorites, no registration required and great graphics =93 check it out! http://www.games.com?ncid=emlcntusgame00000001)________________________________________________________________________________Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 14:08:08 -0700 (PDT)
Re: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum Struts
Original Posted By: Jeff Boatright